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Post by silverdragon on Jan 16, 2014 8:06:30 GMT
Throttle and brake, toe-and-heel..... Its a recognised driving method, much favoured by racing, which allows you to tap brakes on corners?..
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Post by the light works on Jan 16, 2014 14:52:15 GMT
He wasnt joking when he said I would need an engineering degree to drive the thing then?.... Thats too complicated..... Yet they sold in the thousands?... it's actually not so bad. set the throttle, hold the brake with one foot while letting the lever to the middle, then press the low pedal with the other foot while letting up the brake. advance the throttle to bring up the speed, then let go of the pedal and the lever while reducing throttle.
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Post by c64 on Jan 16, 2014 16:59:45 GMT
Throttle and brake, toe-and-heel..... Its a recognised driving method, much favoured by racing, which allows you to tap brakes on corners?.. Try this with a vehicle which is equipped with old drum brakes and/or no brake booster
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Post by c64 on Jan 16, 2014 17:03:08 GMT
and reverse where low should be is nothing special - it's normal for a 3-speed. it lets you have a simple "H" pattern, instead of having goofy offset shift gates. But not for a 4 or 5 speed gearbox. The particular vehicle I drove had a 4 speed R 2 4 |-|-| 1 3 During a touring race, you are mostly switching between 2th and 3th gear. You almost are never fast enough to use the 4th gear and drifting around corners, you never use the 1th gear again after starting to move.
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Post by the light works on Jan 17, 2014 0:20:37 GMT
Throttle and brake, toe-and-heel..... Its a recognised driving method, much favoured by racing, which allows you to tap brakes on corners?.. Try this with a vehicle which is equipped with old drum brakes and/or no brake booster Like this one? Attachment Deletedaddendum: but I do remember back before power brakes were the norm, some people of lighter stature would use both feet on the brake pedal
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Post by the light works on Jan 17, 2014 0:24:25 GMT
and reverse where low should be is nothing special - it's normal for a 3-speed. it lets you have a simple "H" pattern, instead of having goofy offset shift gates. But not for a 4 or 5 speed gearbox. The particular vehicle I drove had a 4 speed R 2 4 |-|-| 1 3 During a touring race, you are mostly switching between 2th and 3th gear. You almost are never fast enough to use the 4th gear and drifting around corners, you never use the 1th gear again after starting to move. in all the 4 speed gearboxes I have driven you never use first unless you are starting out on a steep upgrade with a heavy trailer, or pulling stumps. the 5 speeds just added another gate above reverse. - which meant when I was backwoodsing with my old pickup, I was between 3rd and 4th, depending on the corners.
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Post by silverdragon on Jan 17, 2014 8:03:39 GMT
This is why perhaps Index Sequential gear shifts were invented.... I remember them back in the 80's even... still fully manual with Clutch. I never saw the need to go further at the time, I still believe they were "just right"?... It didnt take much to just kick the clutch pedal as you shifted gear... Plus I dragged the clutch on changes to keep the revs up. Yes that way chews through Clutches, but keeping the revs high was useful, especially in the early days of Turbo. The paddle-shift you get now on modern sports vehicles, I like, but am no so sure about. I dont know why, I just dont trust them to be reliable... Perhaps its just another outing of my anti-overly-Complicated mind at work?... Heel and toe braking on older Drum brakes with no "booster"... I used to race Mini. It was an accepted way to actually drive a Mini on the road after heavy rain to dry out the brakes.... Boosters?... dont need them on a Mini.... If you need extra braking, you go "Flintstone" and put your feet through the rust holes in the floor .
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Post by c64 on Jan 17, 2014 14:34:00 GMT
Real touring cars don't use the clutch to shift gears. All you need to do is to cut the strain in the gearbox for a moment. This can easily be done by the so called "gear cut". This is a little computer which suppresses the ignition for a very short moment. As a result, you can switch gears a lot faster but the unburned fuel is dumped into the hot exhaust pipe so you can tell that the car shifts a gear from great distance.
In this video, you can hear (and often see) the gearcut in action.
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Post by the light works on Jan 17, 2014 14:47:58 GMT
Real touring cars don't use the clutch to shift gears. All you need to do is to cut the strain in the gearbox for a moment. This can easily be done by the so called "gear cut". This is a little computer which suppresses the ignition for a very short moment. As a result, you can switch gears a lot faster but the unburned fuel is dumped into the hot exhaust pipe so you can tell that the car shifts a gear from great distance. In this video, you can hear (and often see) the gearcut in action. it can also be done by feathering the throttle for a moment. Downshifting is a bit trickier, as you have to feather then rev to match gearbox speeds. doing it under hard braking in a truck, with a 12 inch throw on the shift lever, becomes a dance that quickly separates the veterans from the greenhorns. or more to the point:
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Post by c64 on Jan 17, 2014 15:12:05 GMT
it can also be done by feathering the throttle for a moment. That's the idea, but the throttle has a massive response time. Messing with the injection is also not good enough so they use a computer disabling the ignition in the correct moment for as short as possible. There are super cars for the rich which mimic this effect by injecting gasoline into the exhaust system. They use a twin-clutch but have a gadget to create the rally gearcut sound.
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Post by the light works on Jan 17, 2014 15:16:49 GMT
it can also be done by feathering the throttle for a moment. That's the idea, but the throttle has a massive response time. Messing with the injection is also not good enough so they use a computer disabling the ignition in the correct moment for as short as possible. There are super cars for the rich which mimic this effect by injecting gasoline into the exhaust system. They use a twin-clutch but have a gadget to create the rally gearcut sound. or the drivers are too hamhanded to develop the proper touch with it.
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Post by c64 on Jan 17, 2014 15:24:31 GMT
There's a neat documentary about someone who started his own rally racing team from scratch.
This clip is from the first time the car really worked (except for minor problems and a working gearcut sytem).
In the middle of the video, the guy who modified the engine said: "You don't create an engine to make it sound good. The sound doesn't matter at all!" *cut* The driver: "I designed the exhaust system to make this car sound really sick to sound real big and powerful. No other car has such a powerful sound!"
And near the end of this clip, all the Sponsor is fascinated from is the "dirty sound" it makes and this makes him happy.
So in this case, the sound engineering did work as a fundraiser. Won't help winning a race but it won the sponsor.
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Post by the light works on Jan 17, 2014 15:27:08 GMT
now, here's some proper open wheel racing for y'all.
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Post by c64 on Jan 17, 2014 15:27:12 GMT
or the drivers are too hamhanded to develop the proper touch with it.[/quote] During such races, milliseconds count. There is no way that manual input can affect the engine fast enough. The gearcut usually kills 3 or 4 workstrokes of the engine, it's impossible to manage the same using the accelerator. The moment it takes that releasing the throttle affects the engine, the gearcut system had switched gears and is on full power throughput of the engine already.
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Post by the light works on Jan 17, 2014 15:31:33 GMT
and here is the direction the "add driver aids" model of racing is going.
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Post by c64 on Jan 17, 2014 15:48:29 GMT
now, here's some proper open wheel racing for y'all. In Germany, we don't have anything like this. But we do have "single-axis" tractor races: Those races are very popular in the South of Germany, Austria and Swiss. Here's a video from Swiss: Those things are meant for work And Transportation by adding a trailer. And adding a minimalistic trailer, you have something neat to race around with
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Post by the light works on Jan 17, 2014 16:15:35 GMT
'Murican overkill vs. old school iron. no replacement for displacement.
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Post by c64 on Jan 17, 2014 16:27:35 GMT
'Murican overkill vs. old school iron. no replacement for displacement. Well, in this case, "dead weight" is all that matters. More weight, more grip. The engine power doesn't matter at all. I had won such a pull with my 15 HP "mini tractor" against a 420HP farming tractor monster. While my tractor was only 1/4 the size and had a little 1-piston Diesel engine, it had a lot of weight. It isn't nicknamed "iron pig" for no reason! Also the old narrow tires have a lot more grip on dirt. The super wide wheels on modern farming equipment is meant to prevent compacting the ground which kills plants. Until the 90s, you saw clear tire paths in wheat fields, nowadays the wheat fields have no tractor tracks in them. So such tractor vs tractor pulls are just plain unfair. My opponent had AWD but I played a dirty trick. I locked my rear wheels until dug in and when the other tractor started to have wheel slip, I slowly started to pull. Under normal circumstances, the opponent could pull me with up to 63kph (limited by law) with ease. I was only able to pull him with 1.5kph at best!
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Post by the light works on Jan 17, 2014 16:45:38 GMT
'Murican overkill vs. old school iron. no replacement for displacement. Well, in this case, "dead weight" is all that matters. More weight, more grip. The engine power doesn't matter at all. I had won such a pull with my 15 HP "mini tractor" against a 420HP farming tractor monster. While my tractor was only 1/4 the size and had a little 1-piston Diesel engine, it had a lot of weight. It isn't nicknamed "iron pig" for no reason! Also the old narrow tires have a lot more grip on dirt. The super wide wheels on modern farming equipment is meant to prevent compacting the ground which kills plants. Until the 90s, you saw clear tire paths in wheat fields, nowadays the wheat fields have no tractor tracks in them. So such tractor vs tractor pulls are just plain unfair. My opponent had AWD but I played a dirty trick. I locked my rear wheels until dug in and when the other tractor started to have wheel slip, I slowly started to pull. Under normal circumstances, the opponent could pull me with up to 63kph (limited by law) with ease. I was only able to pull him with 1.5kph at best! the angle of the drawbar is making a difference in this video, too. but really, the deciding factor in this one is the huge amount of standing torque the steam tractor can develop.
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Post by the light works on Jan 17, 2014 16:59:25 GMT
more nice old iron - and impressive that they could fire it from a standing position to start.
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