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Post by kharnynb on Feb 4, 2016 19:19:29 GMT
when you guys say 100 amp, my first reaction is always "damn, that's big." Then i remember, 65 amp x 220 volt is more than 100 amp x 110 volt...oops  |
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Post by GTCGreg on Feb 4, 2016 21:35:57 GMT
when you guys say 100 amp, my first reaction is always "damn, that's big." Then i remember, 65 amp x 220 volt is more than 100 amp x 110 volt...oops It is 100 A at 240 volts. It's actually two 120 V 100 amp breakers. If you go between either and neutral, you get 120 V at a total of 200A. If you go across the two, you get 240 V at 100 A. We use the 120 V circuits for general lighting and small appliances and 240V for larger loads such as air-conditioning, water heaters, cooking stove and electric clothes dryer's. I have a 220 Volt plug in the garage for my air compressor, MIG welder and plasma cutter. Newer homes here now have 200 amp/240 V entrances and I've even seen a few 300A in homes. |
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Post by the light works on Feb 5, 2016 3:50:41 GMT
when you guys say 100 amp, my first reaction is always "damn, that's big." Then i remember, 65 amp x 220 volt is more than 100 amp x 110 volt...oops our standard panel is now 200 amps. it's not " damn, that's big" until you get to his level. Attachment DeletedAttachment Deletedyes, you're looking at two 200 amp 40 circuit panels fed off a 400 amp service. |
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Post by the light works on Feb 5, 2016 3:54:36 GMT
to put things in perspective - I'm finishing off a pair of 750 square foot cottages. each one has 24 tabs of a 30 tab panel filled. granted, I'm a bit more generous than average with my circuits - but OTOH, he other project I'm finishing off has 36 tabs of a 30 tab panel filled. (same one I was venting about the previous contractor not labeling the circuits.)
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Post by GTCGreg on Feb 5, 2016 5:20:57 GMT
to put things in perspective - I'm finishing off a pair of 750 square foot cottages. each one has 24 tabs of a 30 tab panel filled. granted, I'm a bit more generous than average with my circuits - but OTOH, he other project I'm finishing off has 36 tabs of a 30 tab panel filled. (same one I was venting about the previous contractor not labeling the circuits.) It doesn't make sense NOT to put in more circuits when you're working with new construction. What's a new circuit cost? Four or five dollars for the breaker? You still have to run the wires one way or the other. Might as well put them on their own circuit. |
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Post by the light works on Feb 5, 2016 5:45:47 GMT
to put things in perspective - I'm finishing off a pair of 750 square foot cottages. each one has 24 tabs of a 30 tab panel filled. granted, I'm a bit more generous than average with my circuits - but OTOH, he other project I'm finishing off has 36 tabs of a 30 tab panel filled. (same one I was venting about the previous contractor not labeling the circuits.) It doesn't make sense NOT to put in more circuits when you're working with new construction. What's a new circuit cost? Four or five dollars for the breaker? You still have to run the wires one way or the other. Might as well put them on their own circuit. with arc fault rules, it can be as much as $70.00 for the breaker. - and it's not having 36 circuits I'm irritated at so much as having 36 circuits in a 30 circuit panel |
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Post by kharnynb on Feb 5, 2016 7:12:04 GMT
Our main breaker is 3 x 65 amp for a 2 apartment building, 220v single phase and 400v 3 phase for stoves.
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Post by GTCGreg on Feb 5, 2016 8:25:28 GMT
It doesn't make sense NOT to put in more circuits when you're working with new construction. What's a new circuit cost? Four or five dollars for the breaker? You still have to run the wires one way or the other. Might as well put them on their own circuit. with arc fault rules, it can be as much as $70.00 for the breaker. - and it's not having 36 circuits I'm irritated at so much as having 36 circuits in a 30 circuit panel Are arc faults required everywhere now, or just bedroom circuits? |
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Post by silverdragon on Feb 5, 2016 8:51:15 GMT
when you guys say 100 amp, my first reaction is always "damn, that's big." Then i remember, 65 amp x 220 volt is more than 100 amp x 110 volt...oops The shower I am using, on 10mmwiring single circuit, requires a 65amp circuit breaker, as it keeps popping the 45amp "Usual" shower circuit breaker supplied.... This s brand new wiring. I was fed up with the old circuit popping the fuse and getting warm. So I started from the fuse box and put all new in from there to the shower, through a double pole isolation switch outside the bathroom to keep to Code, and tacked in a new small extrusion fan (less than 2 amp draw max) to de-fog the windows. Yet still the shower trips the 45amp fuse?... I have metered out everything, its all good, its a brand new shower as well, its just if you shower for any reasonable time it needs occasionally more than 45 amps. on 240vAC. Yep its powerful... max rating is 3kw, but it never gets that hot. I just bought one that was a little better than needed?. |
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Post by GTCGreg on Feb 5, 2016 8:55:46 GMT
Funny. We use pipes to connect our showers over here, not wires.
Being a little more serious, those point of use instant shower heaters never really caught on over here.
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Post by silverdragon on Feb 5, 2016 9:01:01 GMT
to put things in perspective - I'm finishing off a pair of 750 square foot cottages. each one has 24 tabs of a 30 tab panel filled. granted, I'm a bit more generous than average with my circuits - but OTOH, he other project I'm finishing off has 36 tabs of a 30 tab panel filled. (same one I was venting about the previous contractor not labeling the circuits.) It doesn't make sense NOT to put in more circuits when you're working with new construction. What's a new circuit cost? Four or five dollars for the breaker? You still have to run the wires one way or the other. Might as well put them on their own circuit. Which is what I did when we changed the fuse box to MCB panel. It had more than needed space, so, I stuffed it with a couple of quid each breakers, and separated out the plug socket circuits, so I can now isolate every room, and twice in the kitchen, plus the cooker shower and oven each have their own circuits, with the central heating on its own as well, which are "code". The lighting is split into upstairs and downstairs, with the bathroom lighting on its own as well, "Just in case" there is water ingress into that circuit.... which is all double insulated "waterproof", but you cant take too much care?.. I have also split the circuit I have the TV/Entertainment system on onto its own spur, and therefore its own circuit, just because the living room has far too many gadgets for just one circuit. All this has been done "to code", and then I get my friend who is a fully qualified spark to pass over my work as two sets of eyes are better than one. He is happy to sign the certificate as well. Electrickery is dangerous, I dont take chances, I also have a circuit tester plug I carry with me everywhere I do electrical work, and have been known to ask my friends who ask me to change a light switch for them to get a spark in to check the whole of the house if I even get a flicker on that tester. Maybe its my Driving that makes me a little paranoid over safety issues?.. I dunno, I just have this feeling that if you think there may be a fault, its your duty to check it out?. |
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Post by the light works on Feb 5, 2016 15:20:13 GMT
Our main breaker is 3 x 65 amp for a 2 apartment building, 220v single phase and 400v 3 phase for stoves. is it more common than not to use gas or oil for heating and cooking, there? here we have large regions that use all electric power. |
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Post by the light works on Feb 5, 2016 15:25:48 GMT
with arc fault rules, it can be as much as $70.00 for the breaker. - and it's not having 36 circuits I'm irritated at so much as having 36 circuits in a 30 circuit panel Are arc faults required everywhere now, or just bedroom circuits? everywhere that is considered living space - which excludes kitchen, dining room, bathrooms, and garage. It is not a move I fully agree with, as most of the electrical fires I have been involved with would not have been prevented by an arc fault breaker, being either not on a circuit that would have been protected, or not of a nature an arc fault would have recognized until it was too late. meanwhile, many electricians are using the least number of circuits they can get away with to save money on breakers. - which has the potential to result in overloaded circuits and more fires of a nature the arc fault breaker will not recognize until it is too late. |
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Post by the light works on Feb 5, 2016 15:28:30 GMT
Funny. We use pipes to connect our showers over here, not wires. Being a little more serious, those point of use instant shower heaters never really caught on over here. they run 240V to their shower head, and think we're crazy for allowing 120V next to the basin. |
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Post by the light works on Feb 5, 2016 15:31:10 GMT
It doesn't make sense NOT to put in more circuits when you're working with new construction. What's a new circuit cost? Four or five dollars for the breaker? You still have to run the wires one way or the other. Might as well put them on their own circuit. Which is what I did when we changed the fuse box to MCB panel. It had more than needed space, so, I stuffed it with a couple of quid each breakers, and separated out the plug socket circuits, so I can now isolate every room, and twice in the kitchen, plus the cooker shower and oven each have their own circuits, with the central heating on its own as well, which are "code". The lighting is split into upstairs and downstairs, with the bathroom lighting on its own as well, "Just in case" there is water ingress into that circuit.... which is all double insulated "waterproof", but you cant take too much care?.. I have also split the circuit I have the TV/Entertainment system on onto its own spur, and therefore its own circuit, just because the living room has far too many gadgets for just one circuit. All this has been done "to code", and then I get my friend who is a fully qualified spark to pass over my work as two sets of eyes are better than one. He is happy to sign the certificate as well. Electrickery is dangerous, I dont take chances, I also have a circuit tester plug I carry with me everywhere I do electrical work, and have been known to ask my friends who ask me to change a light switch for them to get a spark in to check the whole of the house if I even get a flicker on that tester. Maybe its my Driving that makes me a little paranoid over safety issues?.. I dunno, I just have this feeling that if you think there may be a fault, its your duty to check it out?. if I had 240V to everything I'd be a bit paranoid, too. I've worked with 277V lighting, and that leaves a mark, though. |
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Post by kharnynb on Feb 5, 2016 15:35:40 GMT
Finland is purely electric stove/oven country, unlike say The netherlands, where it's mostly gaslines to the house and stoves.
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Post by the light works on Feb 5, 2016 15:45:26 GMT
Finland is purely electric stove/oven country, unlike say The netherlands, where it's mostly gaslines to the house and stoves. wait one, your nominal voltage is 220, so 65 amps three phase is just under 43KVA, while our 200A 120/240 single phase is 48KVA, so we're within the range of nice round numbers. we use 200A because most normal size houses can run on 200 amps or less, and they can build the gear by the truckload, that way. similarly, most homes have 50 gallon water heaters, because they are big enough for most families, and a bigger family (or a more wasteful one) simply puts two side by side. - they sell them by the truckload, for about half what it costs to buy any other size. (remember, we typically use a central water heater, instead of multiple point of use water heaters) |
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Post by GTCGreg on Feb 5, 2016 16:26:34 GMT
Finland is purely electric stove/oven country, unlike say The netherlands, where it's mostly gaslines to the house and stoves. wait one, your nominal voltage is 220, so 65 amps three phase is just under 43KVA, while our 200A 120/240 single phase is 48KVA, so we're within the range of nice round numbers. we use 200A because most normal size houses can run on 200 amps or less, and they can build the gear by the truckload, that way. similarly, most homes have 50 gallon water heaters, because they are big enough for most families, and a bigger family (or a more wasteful one) simply puts two side by side. - they sell them by the truckload, for about half what it costs to buy any other size. (remember, we typically use a central water heater, instead of multiple point of use water heaters) You're right. I have a 75 gallon heater and it cost over twice as much is a 50. The only reason I didn't go with two 50's is because of space limitations. |
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Post by the light works on Feb 5, 2016 16:56:05 GMT
wait one, your nominal voltage is 220, so 65 amps three phase is just under 43KVA, while our 200A 120/240 single phase is 48KVA, so we're within the range of nice round numbers. we use 200A because most normal size houses can run on 200 amps or less, and they can build the gear by the truckload, that way. similarly, most homes have 50 gallon water heaters, because they are big enough for most families, and a bigger family (or a more wasteful one) simply puts two side by side. - they sell them by the truckload, for about half what it costs to buy any other size. (remember, we typically use a central water heater, instead of multiple point of use water heaters) You're right. I have a 75 gallon heater and it cost over twice as much is a 50. The only reason I didn't go with two 50's is because of space limitations. I could probably even find a kit to wire two 50s to share a circuit. |
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Post by kharnynb on Feb 5, 2016 17:11:12 GMT
finland is one of the few countries that has higher residential consumption than the US, mostly because our climate and a lot of apartment buildings are 1980's junk with pure electrical heating.
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