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Post by ironhold on Aug 7, 2017 15:56:08 GMT
This comes up from a discussion elsewhere.
Here in Texas, you'll see a lot of jokes and legends about armadillos, which are so often seen as "roadkill waiting to happen". I actually used to have a t-shirt (might still have it; I'd have to find it) which presented an armadillo using roadkill'd armadillos as ingredients for his roadside chili stand.
However, there's another term used to describe them: the "Texas State Speed Bump".
The legend goes as such: if an armadillo has a chance to ball up before impact, the armored shell provides 100% protection. Because of this, if your vehicle strikes the balled armadillo in the wrong fashion, it'll flip your car. The best you can hope for is that you dodge it, or if you can't dodge it then it goes up underneath your vehicle.
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Post by the light works on Aug 7, 2017 16:01:02 GMT
obviously the protection the shell offers can't be tested to destruction without getting in trouble for potentially harming armadilloes; but the car flipping is right up their alley - just substitute concrete for the armadillo, and use a remote control rig to give the best chance for them losing control of the car.
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Post by ironhold on Aug 7, 2017 16:22:38 GMT
obviously the protection the shell offers can't be tested to destruction without getting in trouble for potentially harming armadilloes; but the car flipping is right up their alley - just substitute concrete for the armadillo, and use a remote control rig to give the best chance for them losing control of the car. I'm sure that there are more than a few biologists and zoologists who have studied armadillo shells over the years, so surely someone will know what we're dealing with. |
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Post by wvengineer on Aug 7, 2017 19:07:58 GMT
Can anyone provide the shell from a armadillo that expired due to natural causes? Maybe a Zoo? Or can someone build a reasonable replacement? Talk with a local university?
I have my doupts with this since I have bit several turtles, albeit it small Box Turtles. There is a bit of a bump, but the shell is destroyed by even a small car. I know people who have hit larger snapping turtles that can be over 2 ft in size and again, the car comes out on top.
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Post by ironhold on Aug 7, 2017 20:47:03 GMT
Can anyone provide the shell from a armadillo that expired due to natural causes? Maybe a Zoo? Or can someone build a reasonable replacement? Talk with a local university? I have my doupts with this since I have bit several turtles, albeit it small Box Turtles. There is a bit of a bump, but the shell is destroyed by even a small car. I know people who have hit larger snapping turtles that can be over 2 ft in size and again, the car comes out on top. I'm aware of at least one commercial operation that deals in armadillo meat (I've seen small cans of it in novelty stores), so the shells would likely be by-products of the meat harvesting. That being said however, if we are going the route of "actual shells" it should be noted that armadillo meat itself reputedly contains a lot of nasties, up to and including leprosy, that can mean for some very bad things if not cooked all the way through. |
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Post by silverdragon on Aug 8, 2017 8:32:54 GMT
Of course presuming no animals will be harmed or even threatened during testing, thats obvious "goes without saying", but should be said?..
This is going to depend on two variables, weight, and speed.
Smaller cars with good suspension stand a better chance of surviving, and smaller shells of course.
Are we testing the survivability of the vehicle, or the animal?.
I am suspecting a suspension setup that can handle a house brick or other unexpected debris in the road, at average speed, no more than say 55mph, will proof of concept, that your average vehicle may survive.
Big heavy HGV commercial trucks, not the same, I have run over a spare wheel that fell off the back of a jeep {I think?..} at about 40mph one time, it caused not much damage at all, I had to re-attach a mud flap, and take the dent out of the roof where my head hit it, but that was one heck of a bounce, I wouldnt want to be doing that too many times.
The drivers seat takes a lot of bangs, but my eyeballs were spinning for a while.
Why did I hit it?.. I couldnt change lanes and had no escape route, no time to react.
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Post by Cybermortis on Aug 8, 2017 16:31:00 GMT
This could actually be a strange and interesting thing to look at, especially since I ran across a story the other day where a man fired three shots at an Armadillo from a .38 revolver. Apparently one of the three shots bounced back and hit him, while the armadillo seems to have scuttled away having survived all three shots. (It wasn't found in the area anyway)
If they were testing one they might as well test the other.
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Post by ironhold on Aug 8, 2017 17:57:38 GMT
Of course presuming no animals will be harmed or even threatened during testing, thats obvious "goes without saying", but should be said?.. This is going to depend on two variables, weight, and speed. Smaller cars with good suspension stand a better chance of surviving, and smaller shells of course. Are we testing the survivability of the vehicle, or the animal?. I am suspecting a suspension setup that can handle a house brick or other unexpected debris in the road, at average speed, no more than say 55mph, will proof of concept, that your average vehicle may survive. Big heavy HGV commercial trucks, not the same, I have run over a spare wheel that fell off the back of a jeep {I think?..} at about 40mph one time, it caused not much damage at all, I had to re-attach a mud flap, and take the dent out of the roof where my head hit it, but that was one heck of a bounce, I wouldnt want to be doing that too many times. The drivers seat takes a lot of bangs, but my eyeballs were spinning for a while. Why did I hit it?.. I couldnt change lanes and had no escape route, no time to react. Thing is, bricks (et al) are square, while shells are rounded. The vehicle would essentially be hitting a lozenge shape, something that might make it easier for the car to hop over it since the upper part of the curve could well serve as a ramp-like structure. |
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Post by GTCGreg on Aug 8, 2017 18:41:34 GMT
If you're going to test hitting an armadillo, whatever you hit better simulate the look and feel of an armadillo. Bricks don't.
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Post by the light works on Aug 8, 2017 23:47:39 GMT
This could actually be a strange and interesting thing to look at, especially since I ran across a story the other day where a man fired three shots at an Armadillo from a .38 revolver. Apparently one of the three shots bounced back and hit him, while the armadillo seems to have scuttled away having survived all three shots. (It wasn't found in the area anyway) If they were testing one they might as well test the other. one must consider, this being an american with a revolver, the probability that more of the shots hit the man than hit the armadillo. I have a friend who hit himself with shrapnel while shooting a steel wheel, and I have seen ricochets from a dirt bank, while shooting tracers. |
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Post by the light works on Aug 8, 2017 23:52:54 GMT
If you're going to test hitting an armadillo, whatever you hit better simulate the look and feel of an armadillo. Bricks don't. as I said, a concrete likeness. |
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Post by silverdragon on Aug 9, 2017 6:36:15 GMT
If you're going to test hitting an armadillo, whatever you hit better simulate the look and feel of an armadillo. Bricks don't. Dependant on the size of wheel and the speed you hit it at, if it doesnt suddenly deflate, the wheel suffers almost exactly the same forces between a brick and a small ramp. I suppose that could be tested. Take a brick, and a brick cut down the length on a diagonal, and feed them under a wheel, collect data on the suspension travel and "speed of change" of that travel, also shock forces involved, and compare. But to anyone holding the wheel when you hit something say Six inch high at for instance 40 mph, if you dont have power assistance, thats going to snatch the wheel out of your hand [which is why you are taught to never loop thumbs on the inside of the wheel] and snatch the vehicle to one side suddenly... Power assistance with positive feedback, as in any modern power system that runs the steering on a reasonably good vehicle that allows you to feel the road, you will notice the bump. I am assuming the average armadillo of the fully grown variety is going to be a bit more than 6 inch "When compressed". It has to be asked how much of that will get under a modern car if that said car has either been "Slammed to the ground" or designed with low ride height?. So we have to assume an average car maybe the size of a common pickup, thats liable to be driven "in the wilds", with suggested minimum 15 inch wheels attached. Minimum... if you have anything over 7 inch high, that 15 inch wheel will struggle to climb it at speed, even if the suspension can handle that. I have a friend who drives "something" that is in size larger than my own car, but he has 13 inch wheels... fo-real?.. the thing struggles to climb kerbs. It also has problems exceeding the national speed limit of 60 mph if its loaded. I wouldnt want to hit a roadkill squirrel with those wheels... Mini's [original] come with 10 inch wheels, you tend to play the game of dodge the pit hole when driving one, but as they are a lot smaller, you can, you have the road space, and they are fun anyway. |
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Post by ironhold on Aug 9, 2017 6:58:25 GMT
"In the wilds"?
Wildlife incursion is an issue in parts of Texas like where I live; even though we're a suburban community of thirty thousand, we've got all sorts of critters about. This includes armadillos, which have of late been showing up in larger numbers as construction, weather, and other matters drive them about. I kid you not when I say that after dark, the deer pretty well own several neighborhoods.
So in a case like this, we can use everyday sedans and saloons since those will also be in danger of hitting one.
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Post by the light works on Aug 9, 2017 7:35:23 GMT
the secondary myth in this is that Armadillos, when converting from "hope they don't see me" to "roll in a ball" mode are said to jump off the ground - approximately to the height of the average car radiator grille.
the factor I have been looking at is that there are two accident potentials involved. "it will flip your car" is interpreted as the wheel going over the armadillo will be thrown high enough to take the car upside down; when it must also be considered, as with another driving safety myth we discussed, the usual sort of inattentive driver will lose control upon hitting the armadillo.
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Post by silverdragon on Aug 9, 2017 10:01:31 GMT
Simple test of a jumping armadillo damage would be suspend a bowling ball at radiator height on a length of rope with a quick release {or just snap off] and drive at it.?..
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Post by the light works on Aug 9, 2017 13:31:46 GMT
Simple test of a jumping armadillo damage would be suspend a bowling ball at radiator height on a length of rope with a quick release {or just snap off] and drive at it.?.. some sort of spring loaded popper would be more fun. |
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Post by c64 on Aug 22, 2018 21:33:41 GMT
I don't know anything about your "Texas speed bumps" but in 1998 when I was in the military, I have read an article about "Roadworthy Hedgehogs".
When you shine light onto a hedgehog, it used to always curl up into a ball. So when a hedgehog is on a road at night, it used to always curl up when vehicles approached. This is bad since the airdrag can roll them into the path of the wheels of the next vehicle easily. The article claimed that German hedgehogs had adapted to this problem, now approx. 50% do not curl up any more (this was 1998).
During a very large and intense wargame, I rode a truck along a road outside of the simulated war zone at night. After a turn, some hedehogs had appeared in the camouflage lights and we stopped. After discussing what is more important,the orders to stay camouflaged or to safe wildlife, we switched on the high beams to look at the situation. There were hundreds of hedgehogs running over the road fleeing from the wargame and the moment we saw them all in the bright lights, about half of them curled up.
This was very amazing. I had almost forgotten the article and suddenly I was in an epic experiment which had confirmed it!
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Post by the light works on Aug 23, 2018 2:17:50 GMT
I don't know anything about your "Texas speed bumps" but in 1998 when I was in the military, I have read an article about "Roadworthy Hedgehogs". When you shine light onto a hedgehog, it used to always curl up into a ball. So when a hedgehog is on a road at night, it used to always curl up when vehicles approached. This is bad since the airdrag can roll them into the path of the wheels of the next vehicle easily. The article claimed that German hedgehogs had adapted to this problem, now approx. 50% do not curl up any more (this was 1998). During a very large and intense wargame, I rode a truck along a road outside of the simulated war zone at night. After a turn, some hedehogs had appeared in the camouflage lights and we stopped. After discussing what is more important,the orders to stay camouflaged or to safe wildlife, we switched on the high beams to look at the situation. There were hundreds of hedgehogs running over the road fleeing from the wargame and the moment we saw them all in the bright lights, about half of them curled up. This was very amazing. I had almost forgotten the article and suddenly I was in an epic experiment which had confirmed it! here, if a squirrel on the roadway notices a car approaching, many of them will run to the center of the traffic lane and crouch to avoid getting hit. |
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Post by c64 on Aug 26, 2018 9:17:59 GMT
In middle Europe, crows have learnt a new way to open nuts they can't crack with their beak.
Usually they take the nuts, fly very high and drop them onto stones (e.g. sidewalk). This doesn't work well and is very energy intensive.
Now they take the nuts and drop them onto crosswalks and then wait sitting on the traffic light. When the pedestrian light turns green, they collect the nuts whcih were crushed by passing cars.
I've seen this several times in Cologne and Bonn.
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Post by mrfatso on Aug 26, 2018 10:15:39 GMT
In middle Europe, crows have learnt a new way to open nuts they can't crack with their beak. Usually they take the nuts, fly very high and drop them onto stones (e.g. sidewalk). This doesn't work well and is very energy intensive. Now they take the nuts and drop them onto crosswalks and then wait sitting on the traffic light. When the pedestrian light turns green, they collect the nuts whcih were crushed by passing cars. I've seen this several times in Cologne and Bonn. That does not surprise me. Corvids are smart birds and some are capable f making their own tools. www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-politics-42781068/crafty-new-caledonian-crows-make-hunting-tools |
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