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Post by alabastersandman on May 2, 2013 14:22:54 GMT
Never used a ceramic knife but I did stay at a Holiday Inn the other night. ;D ( Holiday Inn add reference) One of the benefits of ceramic as I understand it is that there are no pores in the surface for contamination to stick to. Allegedly this makes the knife impervious to transferring the flavor of one food to another. Also it is touted to be less likely to transfer germs and virus. Another benefit of the ceramic is that the ceramic of the knife itself won't taint the flavor of the food like metals can. I know when I (used to) cut lettuce with a steel knife, the lettuce will quickly brown, ceramic supposedly won't cause this browning. I shred lettuce by hand now.
The light weight of ceramic can be of benefit if you are slicing gobs of fruits and/or veggies. The light weight will cause less fatigue. But the light weight is not good for chopping meat. It's just as well because chopping anything with ceramic will no doubt end badly. In this respect, the light weight is a sort of self preservation aspect of ceramic. Makes me want to get one to try on the fruits I cut up for the dehydrator.
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Post by Antigone68104 on May 2, 2013 21:52:32 GMT
Some friends of mine were given a set of ceramic knives as a wedding present. When they tried taking one of the knives out of the styrofoam packaging, the blade chipped.
I'm certain there are times when a ceramic knife would be the best tool for the job. But I'll stick with my "second-best" steel knives that actually last.
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Post by kharnynb on May 4, 2013 6:02:51 GMT
Ceramic knives get dirty, just like any other knife, you should always wash your knives inbetween different dishpreps, and between raw meat and anything else you cut. If you leave your knife without washing long enough to gather germs or viri, there is worse things hiding in your kitchen already  . Unless you forgot to wash your knife after sharpening, a metal knife will not transfer anything that would taste of metal to the food, contact time is just far too short. Chefs that do tons of food prep will prefer a heavy knife, it cuts for you, instead of a light knife that you would have to press that much harder. Unless you are deboning or butchering, you don't chop at meat, you slice. Lettuce will discolor because of oxigen in the air, the way you slice it has little effect. if you want to prevent the browning, keep it cold and rip instead of slice. |
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Post by alabastersandman on Jun 15, 2013 12:58:11 GMT
Went and bought a ceramic knife. I understand they are supposed to stay sharp for several years... Stay tuned for results...  |
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Post by alabastersandman on Jun 15, 2013 13:03:00 GMT
Ceramic knives get dirty, just like any other knife, you should always wash your knives inbetween different dishpreps, and between raw meat and anything else you cut. If you leave your knife without washing long enough to gather germs or viri, there is worse things hiding in your kitchen already . Unless you forgot to wash your knife after sharpening, a metal knife will not transfer anything that would taste of metal to the food, contact time is just far too short. Chefs that do tons of food prep will prefer a heavy knife, it cuts for you, instead of a light knife that you would have to press that much harder. Unless you are deboning or butchering, you don't chop at meat, you slice. Lettuce will discolor because of oxigen in the air, the way you slice it has little effect. if you want to prevent the browning, keep it cold and rip instead of slice. Deboning and butchering are what I had in mind when mentioning not to chop with a ceramic knife, however after giving it some thought, promted by your post, I doubt anyone make such a knife out of ceramic anyway. |
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Post by silverdragon on Jun 16, 2013 6:37:37 GMT
If the Metal knife IS transferring anything at all, blame it on the person using it for not cleaning it.
Cheap "Blag" steel has been blamed for "Tainting" foods....
I cant personally see how?...
If the knife is clean, if its tainting the food, where is that coming from?...
I would suggest more from surfaces and storage objects not having been cleaned properly?...
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Post by OziRiS on Jun 18, 2013 6:10:37 GMT
I like SD's "does putting knives in the dishwasher make them dull quicker than handwashing them will?" myth idea.
My girlfriend's dad used to be a chef and she was training to be a chef at one point. They both hold this to be true and will both get p**sed if you put one of their "special chef's knives" in the dishwasher. I've done it more than once when I've been in a hurry and haven't noticed they were in between the other knives and so far I've seen nothing to support the claim.
Testing this would bring the show back to basics again, testing everyday things that are widely held beliefs, but which no one seems to know for certain to be true. I'd like to see the show go down that road again.
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Post by silverdragon on Jun 18, 2013 6:48:08 GMT
How to test... just HOW long does a dishwasher have to run to blunt a knife?...
And again, would how you treat the knife in question matter...
As stated, I put the sharp edge away from the water jet direction of flow, does that matter?....
Perhaps three identical knives, one up, one down, one handwashed, BORING job, would have to be washed identical times to dishwasher?...
Anyway, after was is complete, hand them to a trained chef to see if he can discern any difference?...
Perhaps also include "Industrial" dish washers?....
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Post by Cybermortis on Jun 18, 2013 12:03:32 GMT
The problem with dishwashers isn't the water but the cleaning solution used in them. Dishwasher solutions are highly alkali and can be just as if not more corrosive than acid to some materials. This is one of the reasons why glass can turn milky if it goes through a dishwasher frequently, and why some items are listed as not being suitable for dishwashers.
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Post by kharnynb on Jun 20, 2013 15:32:48 GMT
There is also the extended period of the knife being wet compared to handwashing and drying it.
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Post by the light works on Jun 20, 2013 16:23:17 GMT
and the fact that dishwasher detergent has abrasives in it to help scrub things off.
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Post by silverdragon on Jun 24, 2013 8:25:50 GMT
For discussion sake, I aint sure, so a couple of points raised above... TLW, Abrasives?.... I can honestly say I do not use a soft cloth to hand-wash my knives?...  [<<-< whassat?.. new "Smily" I cant make it out?..) Are Dishwasher "Abrasives" any more abrasive than say normal use on a chopping board and washing by hand using a scrubbing sponge or dish wash brush?.... Extended wet... Stainless steel, and wet work butchering, I would bet in a honest kitchen my Knife would spend more time slightly damp in use chopping that it would fully wet in a 1hr dishwash?.... Cant say that being wet should matter?.... Cleaning solutions being Alkali.... I believed Stainless steel to be "Inert" to alkali ?... Or inert to a given value of inert.... As in, they make road tankers with the same stuff to transport tons of liquid alkali around and they dont exactly melt?.... Is alkali, or a mild version of alkali, a valid reason?... I know some modern ones now have a "Plastic liner" that is more inert than Metal for certain loads, but still, Stainless has been a liner of choice for many tanks. |
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Post by the light works on Jun 24, 2013 14:10:29 GMT
do you have "Comet" and "Ajax" on the shelves there? or, for that matter, dishwasher detergent has the equivalent of rubbing compound to help the water knock the residue off.
as for the caustics, one of the chemicals we use in the car wash, at full strength, was destroying the stainless steel metering hardware on about a 3 year cycle. we've switched over to cast resin metering hardware, which seems to be lasting longer.
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Post by silverdragon on Jun 25, 2013 9:22:54 GMT
For the caustics, I have delivered a product that is known in the trade as "Etch", where the delivery instructions emergency advice is in case of spill, scrap the vehicle, 'cos this stuff will melt steel....
It would be an environmental disaster, full containment units to be deployed, its real nasty.
But you just wont be getting that in a dishwasher, will you?...
I see a "Irritant" warning on the dishwasher tablets we use, but I dont see "Use rubber gloves", ....
For reasons of handling by family members, I am thinking that whatever is used must be of a extreme mild variety?..
Household detergents can be quite strong, but, seriously, the inside of a dishwasher is all steel and pressed aluminium, surely they wont advocate a washing solution that eventually melts the fabric of the dishwasher?....
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Post by Cybermortis on Jun 25, 2013 13:08:07 GMT
Remember that the cutting edge of a knife provides a large surface area over which a reaction can take place. It is the same reason why you set fire to wire wool.
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Post by the light works on Jun 25, 2013 15:03:31 GMT
I think I've said it before; but I do wash my kitchen knives in the dishwasher. I typically wash the ones too large for the silverware basket edge up in the upper rack. by my logic, the time I save washing more than adequately compensates me for any extra strokes I have to take on the sharpening steel, and I can live with the handles not being the glossy black they started out.
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Post by alabastersandman on Jul 5, 2013 4:55:48 GMT
Perhaps the "myth" about knives tainting the flavor of food came from how foods like lettuce will brown quicker when cut than when torn. Dishwasher soap is pretty harsh stuff but so is dishwashing soap used in the sink whilst hand washing. Soap for the dishwasher is likely the harsher of the two, given that it has to do much of the work of cleaning compared to "elbow-grease" for hand-washing. The dishwasher will also subject the knives and such for significantly longer periods of time than hand washing. If I have something stuck to the knife, I will scrub only the spot that needs scrubbing, as soon as the spot is removed, I stop cleaning. The dishwasher keeps on "scrubbing" even if/when the knife is clean. P.S. If your wife/spouse/other keeps chipping the blade, however it is she/he chips it, the affect of cleaning will be a moot point.  Over the last seven years my Cutco knives have taken a serious beating. Still better than having no-one to beat up your knives, wouldn't trade it, though I do hide the ceramic knife. |
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[<<-< whassat?.. new "Smily" I cant make it out?..)
Over the last seven years my Cutco knives have taken a serious beating. Still better than having no-one to beat up your knives, wouldn't trade it, though I do hide the ceramic knife.