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Post by c64 on Jun 8, 2013 12:37:24 GMT
Interesting premise, and I love the link ponytail61 posted and the fact that someone actually put it to the test. Seems that overall, horses are more likely to win, but it's not busted since humans HAVE won as well That doesn't include "Joe Average" so that doesn't count. |
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Post by Cybermortis on Jun 8, 2013 12:54:43 GMT
Interesting premise, and I love the link ponytail61 posted and the fact that someone actually put it to the test. Seems that overall, horses are more likely to win, but it's not busted since humans HAVE won as well That doesn't include "Joe Average" so that doesn't count. The myth was that a trained human could outrun a horse. The results of the race posted on the last page seem to indicate that the man who first won the race was a trained marathon runner. |
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Post by silverdragon on Jun 14, 2013 7:31:02 GMT
Pony express change every 5-20 miles, but that was at full gallop.........
Otherwise, I have done 30 mile on horse, a lot faster than walking.....
Running?....
Ok, so get the horse to a canter now and again, trot the rest, and would a horse beat a runner?....
Erm......
If it didnt, I would want a new horse?.
Please can we have more definition of the horse in comparison.....
Is it an average riding school nag, or a race horse, cart horse, buggy horse?... what TYPE of horse are we allowed?...
Otherwise?..
Only one way to find out I suppose....
I have access to a horse, and Rider (Me ride 30 miles these days?... NAH!...) I will ask them to time a 30 mile trip...
I also have Family in Newmarket England in the horse trade....(Its kind of the UK place to be for race horses...)
I will ask their opinion.
They cant be asked to do a full marathon distance, they are for training Race horses, who dont run that far....
Or do they?...
Ok, a fully trained Marathon runner....
Can I get a fully trained marathon running horse please?...
Its only fair we should go that way?....
Otherwise, a fairly average Human against a fairly average Horse....
As in, the average person who does a "Fun run" marathon in around say three hours?....
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Post by Cybermortis on Jun 14, 2013 12:13:01 GMT
It wasn't stated, which is why it would be a good idea for MB to look at as many breeds as they can find.
I'm guessing, however, that the myth probably refers to racing horses - which are bred for speed rather than endurance.
The other factor is the ground conditions. I think I may have noted that there are some types of ground where forcing a horse to go too fast will injure it while a human would be capable of higher speeds without trouble.
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Post by silverdragon on Jun 24, 2013 8:06:37 GMT
I got a few various replies on this subject from "Horse" people.... 1) depends on the terrain. 2) depends on the Horse. 3) depends on the training. Terrain, if the Marathon in question was one of those Iron Man races, and you set a horse trained for the flat, you loose. But... the actual answer is "Claimed" as 50-50, which I dispute, and the test has been done... every year since 1980.... In Wales UK.... although I dispute their results..... (Wikapedia link, 100% "safe" rating from Norton.) en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man_versus_Horse_Marathonquote from that site... However.... There is some controversy regarding Delayed starts for horses, and time spent in Vet checks.... My original estimation that I withheld due to not being sure and wanting to take advice was the horse will win, that I believe is still upheld, because if there is an equal playing field and horse and runner start at the same time, if that horse has had as much training for the event as the runner, the horse in actual time spent racing will win. And sod the time spent in Vet checks.... that is immaterial.... and necessary.... If that is going to be the case, then the Human will probably be receiving a bit of Medical care as well to check they are OK at the end of the race?... So what is the difference?... Ok, so that race is still running.... Can we have EXACT times spent Racing on the course, and who wins in those conditions..... I believe its the horse?... or did I miss-read that?... |
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Post by Cybermortis on Aug 31, 2013 14:16:28 GMT
You were correct that the horse usually wins.
However the distance for that race is less than that of a full marathon, and interestingly seems to be the about same as the distance between the Pony Express stations. This could be an indication that a horse can only maintain a reasonably fast pace for about 20 miles, after which it has to stop and rest or run the risk of dying, even if bred for such runs.
This might further add support for the idea that a (trained) human could outpace a horse over a full marathon - the horse either has to stop a few miles from the end to rest or is likely to drop dead near the finish line. While the human can maintain a consistent speed throughout the race, and will therefore catch up and overtake the horse before the end*
(*Assuming the horse doesn't notice the runner and decide to kick him so he can't get to the finish line....)
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Post by the light works on Sept 12, 2013 14:26:55 GMT
You were correct that the horse usually wins. However the distance for that race is less than that of a full marathon, and interestingly seems to be the about same as the distance between the Pony Express stations. This could be an indication that a horse can only maintain a reasonably fast pace for about 20 miles, after which it has to stop and rest or run the risk of dying, even if bred for such runs. This might further add support for the idea that a (trained) human could outpace a horse over a full marathon - the horse either has to stop a few miles from the end to rest or is likely to drop dead near the finish line. While the human can maintain a consistent speed throughout the race, and will therefore catch up and overtake the horse before the end* (*Assuming the horse doesn't notice the runner and decide to kick him so he can't get to the finish line....) "rubbing is racing" Dale Earnhart |
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Post by Cybermortis on Sept 12, 2013 20:47:13 GMT
Reading back I should have been somewhat more specific in regards speed.
Olympic level marathon runners average some 12.5 miles per hour (the record for men is 12.72 mph, for women 11.6 mph).
Given the figures above for long-distance riding on horses it seems that they average around 11 mph - this would be at a trot, since a faster pace would probably wear the horse out. The specific speed does seem to vary between breeds, and on the size of the horse, but faster paced horses seem to be built for speed not endurance and might well not be able to maintain the higher trotting speed for 26 miles.
It seems therefore that an Olympic level marathon runner should, in theory, be able to maintain a higher average speed than a horse over a full 26 mile race.
I do, btw, find it very interesting that the horse verses man race linked twice above, and the distance between the Pony Express stations are less than 26 miles. In the case of the Pony Express this does seem to indicate that horses can't maintain their best 'jogging' speed for much further than around 20 miles - probably something like 24 miles as the race is 22 miles and presumably no one enters a horse in that race with the intention of killing it.
The jury is out, I guess we'll just have to see if MB pick this one up and test it.
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