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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 5, 2014 9:47:05 GMT
Picked this story up on the net; www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2168061/French-electrician-stranded-Moroccan-desert-rebuilt-wrecked-car-motorbike-drove-civilisation.htmlNormally I'd dismiss this due to the 'source' (the Daily Mail is not known for fact checking), but it has appeared elsewhere. Basic story is that back in the early 1990's a Frenchman's 2CV was disabled in the Moroccan desert 20 miles from anywhere. Rather than sit and wait for help or try to walk back, instead he managed to convert his car into a motorbike using a very limited tool kit he had in the car. It took him 12 days, but he was able to use his improvised bike to get back to civilization. Is this plausible? And if it is it makes you wonder what else you might be able to turn a car into in a survival situation? Or rather what else you might be able to make that could get you out of a dangerous situation. {Note; I'm excluding the obvious fictional example of 'survival contraptions' from the film(s) 'Flight of the Phoenix'. Such a build would not be practical on MB, if only because they would need to get FAA approval to see if it could fly. There is also the fact that the aircraft they built for the first film did fly, but crashed and killed the pilot. So this would seem FAR to dangerous for MB to try under any circumstances. So we'll stick to cars methinks} |
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Post by GTCGreg on Mar 5, 2014 10:34:26 GMT
Wasn't this story discussed to death on the old Disco boards, or am I just imagining that?
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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 5, 2014 11:05:16 GMT
I don't recall coming across this before.
Besides, anything posted on the old Disco boards has long since vanished.
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Post by mrfatso on Mar 5, 2014 13:01:50 GMT
Well, IIRC, a friend of mine used to have a 2CV, they have air cooled engines so you would not need a radiator so that makes it a bit easier, and the whole car based on a 1940s design was made of simple easy to maintain parts, it seems at least plausible.
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Post by the light works on Mar 5, 2014 15:23:49 GMT
I remember it from the old boards - and my impression of the story is that the build is theoretically possible for a person of above average imagination and mechanical skills. the story is supported by the fact that the alleged artifact does, apparently, exist.
as for flight of the phoenix - that was also thoroughly discussed, and I believe one of the points brought up was that the crash was due to pilot error, not failure of the plane. another point being that the plane was specifically selected to be capable of being rebuilt in that manner.
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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 5, 2014 15:47:00 GMT
{Changed the title to make it a little clearer what I was looking for}
I think that the question as to if this is a true story is only half the potential here. It might be interesting to see what else you could do with a car to help you out of a trouble spot, or if there are any other similar stories knocking around - I haven't found any.
Assume that all you have is a fairly basic tool kit to work with, so no welding/cutting equipment beyond a hacksaw, and that you are stuck in the middle of nowhere without realistic hope of anyone finding you. So you could be in a forest, the middle of Alaska or a desert (although they did the latter) with only the tool kit, the damaged car and your imagination.
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Post by OziRiS on Mar 6, 2014 0:20:02 GMT
An upgrade from duct tape to old cars...? I like it!  As far as I can recall (haven't seen an actual 2CV up close for years) it's a fairly light weight vehicle with plate parts that are pretty easy to manipulate. I believe it's mostly made of thin sheet metal. Are there any other cars that might be as easy to work with? I think anything American made would be out of the question, since they're usually a lot heavier and sturdier than a lot of European and Asian cars. EDIT: Just read the entire story and some of the comments and I have to agree with most of the people commenting. If he only had 20 miles to civilization and enough food and water for 12 days, "going into survival mode", for me at least, wouldn't mean taking apart an entire car with basic tools and rebuilding it as a motorcycle. It would mean making a basic cart from the wheels and some sheet metal to haul my supplies and just walking out. It may have been the harsh environment of the Sahara desert, but I'd say that would be both entirely possible and infinitely easier. |
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Post by the light works on Mar 6, 2014 3:58:31 GMT
An upgrade from duct tape to old cars...? I like it! As far as I can recall (haven't seen an actual 2CV up close for years) it's a fairly light weight vehicle with plate parts that are pretty easy to manipulate. I believe it's mostly made of thin sheet metal. Are there any other cars that might be as easy to work with? I think anything American made would be out of the question, since they're usually a lot heavier and sturdier than a lot of European and Asian cars. EDIT: Just read the entire story and some of the comments and I have to agree with most of the people commenting. If he only had 20 miles to civilization and enough food and water for 12 days, "going into survival mode", for me at least, wouldn't mean taking apart an entire car with basic tools and rebuilding it as a motorcycle. It would mean making a basic cart from the wheels and some sheet metal to haul my supplies and just walking out. It may have been the harsh environment of the Sahara desert, but I'd say that would be both entirely possible and infinitely easier. and as for the citation for the vehicle not matching the registration - let's not kid ourselves - the citation was for being where he didn't belong even after he had been told he didn't belong there. |
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Post by OziRiS on Mar 6, 2014 11:06:19 GMT
I noticed one commenter talk about how difficult it would be for him to move the engine himself, but I don't think that commenter has actually looked into the weight of it. I just did and apparantly it comes in at around 27 kgs or just under 60 lbs, so that's actually entirely possible for one man to move around. I'm not sure I'd exert myself that way in a desert with low water reserves, but it's doable.
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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 6, 2014 11:45:23 GMT
I think the key here might have been the engine itself. From everything I've been able to find (starting with Wilki, but moving to other sites) this design of engine, effectively a self-contained air cooled engine, would seem to be ideal for what it did. Similar cars have more complex engines that I suspect you couldn't pull out and use in this way without a hell of a lot of work, ideally in a workshop.
This might cause a rather major problem as far as MB is concerned because the 2CV was not a popular or well selling - they shifted about a thousand of them in the US. This seems to have been the case with some of Citrons other models that used similar engines. Meaning that these cars are rare, classified as 'exotic' and when you find them come with a very high price tag. For example a working VW Beetle in the SF area will set you back $2000-$4000, while the only working 2CV I could find was $19,998.
I don't know of any cars in the US that might be close enough to the 2CV in terms of the engine, let alone the way they were built. But then I'm neither American nor all that knowledgeable about cars - hence posting here since I think this has potential especially if there are any other stories about people converting cars into something else in a survival situation or possible uses for the car in such a situation.
*Blinks*
Couldn't the 2CV be hand-cranked? I'm just thinking of the film 'Ice cold in Alex', where in order to get an ambulance up a steep sand dune they use the crank. If the 2CV could be hand cranked is it possible that you might be able to move the car using the same method?
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Post by mrfatso on Mar 6, 2014 13:50:00 GMT
I believe it could be Hand Cranked, my mate IIRC used to have a Handle.
vW Beetles had air cooled engines, may be a little more complex, as you happen to mention them, may be they could be used as a substitute in a pinch?
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Post by the light works on Mar 6, 2014 15:11:26 GMT
to add to the engine moving equation. I have picked up and carried a Subaru engine, and it sounds like they are twice as big as the 2CV engine.
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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 6, 2014 15:56:08 GMT
I believe it could be Hand Cranked, my mate IIRC used to have a Handle. vW Beetles had air cooled engines, may be a little more complex, as you happen to mention them, may be they could be used as a substitute in a pinch? That might well be a good idea, not only because the engine appears to be of a similar design but the way the cars were constructed appears to be similar to the 2CV (or at least as easy to dismantle). Given the higher popularity of the Beetle and its far lower cost even for a fully working car, this might be a much more practical option than attempting to find a 2CV to use. Come to think of it they might be able to get a couple of Beetles, if one or two come from a scrapyard, allowing them to look at other possibilities - such as maybe seeing if you could create a motor boat. Would that be possible? Could you possibly remove the roof of a car and fit the engine into it to make a boat? (Assuming you can find a way to seal up the windows/doors.) |
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Post by mrfatso on Mar 6, 2014 16:44:34 GMT
I believe it could be Hand Cranked, my mate IIRC used to have a Handle. vW Beetles had air cooled engines, may be a little more complex, as you happen to mention them, may be they could be used as a substitute in a pinch? That might well be a good idea, not only because the engine appears to be of a similar design but the way the cars were constructed appears to be similar to the 2CV (or at least as easy to dismantle). Given the higher popularity of the Beetle and its far lower cost even for a fully working car, this might be a much more practical option than attempting to find a 2CV to use. Come to think of it they might be able to get a couple of Beetles, if one or two come from a scrapyard, allowing them to look at other possibilities - such as maybe seeing if you could create a motor boat. Would that be possible? Could you possibly remove the roof of a car and fit the engine into it to make a boat? (Assuming you can find a way to seal up the windows/doors.) The VW Kubelwagon, of WWII, which was in many ways military cousin of the Beetle, had a variant called the Schwimmenwagon, that was amphibious so I don't see why with access to sealant you could not make VW Beetle float as a boat. This photo take by a chap called Max Smith is at the IWM Duxford, I have seen the same display myself. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Schwimmwagen_at_RAF_Duxford.jpg |
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Post by ironhold on Mar 6, 2014 16:53:02 GMT
I also seem to recall an episode of "Monster Garage" or another such show in which a New Beetle (the 1990s / 2000s Beetle design) was done up so that it could convert into a boat of some sort, and I also vaguely recall an episode in which a school bus was done up so that it could convert into a party boat.
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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 6, 2014 17:17:28 GMT
Keep in mind that the idea is more about what you could turn a car into using little more than a tool kit you happened to have in the car. No cutting/welding equipment, no workshop, no lifting equipment ect. All you have is that tool kit, the car, your wits any possibly any materials that happen to be in the immediate vicinity - such as wood if you were in a forest. (Although how you'd cut down a tree if all you have is a hacksaw is a different matter...Could you modify anything on a car that would allow you to cut a tree down?)
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Post by mrfatso on Mar 6, 2014 18:37:04 GMT
In a forest couldn't you find some kind of plant matter like bracken, and may be pine resin to act as a form of caulking to seal the car doors.
Could you sharpen the teeth of the rack and pinion in the steering mechanism to act as a saw? First you would need to,cut that out, but give time with a hacksaw, and some way to prop the car up maybe.
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Post by GTCGreg on Mar 6, 2014 18:40:27 GMT
The Beetle's engine and transaxle came out as a single unit with the two back wheels attached. I could see possibly building some sort of motortrike using it and one of the front wheels. Maybe just attach a drag bar to the back and only have two wheels. You could steer it with the left and right brake. Not sure if it could be done with just hand tools, but maybe.
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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 6, 2014 19:33:47 GMT
Interesting ideas guys, keep them coming because I think this has potential.
It would give them a 'survival' episode that doesn't involve duct tape.
Ok, maybe a roll or two. But you get the idea.
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Post by mrfatso on Mar 6, 2014 19:36:00 GMT
Well if you have duct tape there is a sealant right there.
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