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Post by the light works on Oct 3, 2014 13:45:48 GMT
In the US college scene, what happens is that as soon as a kid hit's 21, they can legally drink. So between new freedom, being around friends who drink, and being away from home and stabilizing influences there, a lot of youth get into drinking in a big way. Being poor college student, they go for the cheapest way to get as roaring drunk as possible. In my experience, a lot of this is social drinking. Everyone else binges, so they do too. Once they leave school, between starting careers, staring family, and getting into other hobbies, the amount of drinking drops quickly and by the late 20's has leveled off to a much more responsible level. Silver, is that basically how it works in England as well? In most places here it is illegal to serve someone who is intoxicated, but enforcement is a real problem. In Morgantown, some bars and don't watch what people drink, often because there are too many people. Or more commonly, they will get a bunch of alcohol and take it a party at a private residence where there is no regulation. Mrfatso, those pictures look like Morgantown, West Virginia after a WVU football game, only without the burning furniture. A bunch of drunk young adults do basically the same thing, doesn't matter what part of the world you are in. At least the Welsh girls are not dress as promiscuously as they do in Morgantown. around here, they start as soon as they know someone who is 21; particularly if someone's parents are out of town. - and they drink and smoke precisely because they are forbidden to. |
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Post by mrfatso on Oct 3, 2014 15:01:21 GMT
In the US college scene, what happens is that as soon as a kid hit's 21, they can legally drink. So between new freedom, being around friends who drink, and being away from home and stabilizing influences there, a lot of youth get into drinking in a big way. Being poor college student, they go for the cheapest way to get as roaring drunk as possible. In my experience, a lot of this is social drinking. Everyone else binges, so they do too. Once they leave school, between starting careers, staring family, and getting into other hobbies, the amount of drinking drops quickly and by the late 20's has leveled off to a much more responsible level. Silver, is that basically how it works in England as well? In most places here it is illegal to serve someone who is intoxicated, but enforcement is a real problem. In Morgantown, some bars and don't watch what people drink, often because there are too many people. Or more commonly, they will get a bunch of alcohol and take it a party at a private residence where there is no regulation. Mrfatso, those pictures look like Morgantown, West Virginia after a WVU football game, only without the burning furniture. A bunch of drunk young adults do basically the same thing, doesn't matter what part of the world you are in. At least the Welsh girls are not dress as promiscuously as they do in Morgantown. After a big game, okay, but Cardiff can expect to look like that on any given Friday or Saturday night. |
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Post by silverdragon on Oct 4, 2014 8:45:40 GMT
Yes but earlier....
School now ends at 18 yr old, which is legal to drink age, the oppressed now are legal, so they drink to they get ill.
NO ONE tells them they have had enough, the ideology is they encourage each other and see who can consume most, then laugh uproariously at those who fail.
Kids... will they ever grow up?...
What do welsh girls use for protection whilst having sex?...
A Bus shelter.
The photographic sets shown, these are part of the reason I am no longer a Landlord.
The only way I could stay in business was to take over one of those city centre establishments that draws a "party" crowd...
I will not be responsible for that type of behaviour
I couldn't look myself in the mirror if the night before I had that type of scene outside my window.
It bothers me, how can licensees be so irresponsible in the name of profit?... they need to remember we are not the forklifting feregi.
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Post by silverdragon on Oct 4, 2014 8:52:56 GMT
Underage Drinking....
The legal age for drinking in UK does not exist.
PHWATT?... no, seriously, it doesnt.
The legal age at which you can be served is 14 in a public bar accompanied by Parents and then only limited product, with a meal, or 16 for certain cases,
What products is a minefield.
I am trying to keep it brief... therefore, the majority of Bars now have a strict over-18 "Law"...
And as stated in previous posts on this board, as long as each bar law upholds the legal elsewhere law, its law on those premises.
So how do the Young get drink?.... they send the oldest looking one to the bar, either with their ID, or their siblings ID, and hope thats enough in a busy bar.
I have confiscated ID that I believe to be false....
Sort of argument, but as I stated it was my legal duty to confiscate and summon the law, she and her friends ran out before I could finish the sentence....
(It was handed to the next policeman I saw...)
I kept a strict over-25 law, as my establishment was an older generation safe haven away from the under 25's.
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Post by the light works on Oct 4, 2014 14:50:55 GMT
Underage Drinking.... The legal age for drinking in UK does not exist. PHWATT?... no, seriously, it doesnt. The legal age at which you can be served is 14 in a public bar accompanied by Parents and then only limited product, with a meal, or 16 for certain cases, What products is a minefield. I am trying to keep it brief... therefore, the majority of Bars now have a strict over-18 "Law"... And as stated in previous posts on this board, as long as each bar law upholds the legal elsewhere law, its law on those premises. So how do the Young get drink?.... they send the oldest looking one to the bar, either with their ID, or their siblings ID, and hope thats enough in a busy bar. I have confiscated ID that I believe to be false.... Sort of argument, but as I stated it was my legal duty to confiscate and summon the law, she and her friends ran out before I could finish the sentence.... (It was handed to the next policeman I saw...) I kept a strict over-25 law, as my establishment was an older generation safe haven away from the under 25's. here they must raid their parents' liquor cabinet, or have a sibling who is able to buy it, or hire a bum to buy it for them. there IS a loophole that allows a parent to serve their own child at home, but I believe the child is then required to remain at home under supervision, and there may be restrictions on how intoxicated they can be before it becomes a form of child endangerment. |
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Post by Antigone68104 on Oct 5, 2014 16:58:15 GMT
There was an attempt to tighten up laws on underage drinking around here a few years ago. The proposed law was so strict that allowing your kids to participate in Communion/Eucharist in a church that uses wine for the sacrament would have been illegal. Due to the nature of American immigration, we've got a lot of people around here whose ancestors came from traditionally Catholic countries. Guess what didn't pass?
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Post by mrfatso on Oct 5, 2014 17:22:30 GMT
Underage Drinking.... The legal age for drinking in UK does not exist. PHWATT?... no, seriously, it doesnt. The legal age at which you can be served is 14 in a public bar accompanied by Parents and then only limited product, with a meal, or 16 for certain cases, What products is a minefield. I am trying to keep it brief... therefore, the majority of Bars now have a strict over-18 "Law"... And as stated in previous posts on this board, as long as each bar law upholds the legal elsewhere law, its law on those premises. So how do the Young get drink?.... they send the oldest looking one to the bar, either with their ID, or their siblings ID, and hope thats enough in a busy bar. I have confiscated ID that I believe to be false.... Sort of argument, but as I stated it was my legal duty to confiscate and summon the law, she and her friends ran out before I could finish the sentence.... (It was handed to the next policeman I saw...) I kept a strict over-25 law, as my establishment was an older generation safe haven away from the under 25's. here they must raid their parents' liquor cabinet, or have a sibling who is able to buy it, or hire a bum to buy it for them. there IS a loophole that allows a parent to serve their own child at home, but I believe the child is then required to remain at home under supervision, and there may be restrictions on how intoxicated they can be before it becomes a form of child endangerment. You cannot be served alcohol at 14 in a pub with you parents and a meal , you may drink it but not be served yourself your parents must purchase it for you, and I think the age was raised to 16. www.gov.uk/alcohol-young-people-lawI know it seems strange, but in our laws there is a distinction between the physical act of purchasing and serving a drink and drinking that drink. |
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Post by the light works on Oct 5, 2014 21:05:38 GMT
a lot of places in the US have linked underage drinking to loss of driving privileges - get caught drinking underage, and you have to wait an extra year for your driver's license.
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Post by alabastersandman on Oct 6, 2014 1:45:59 GMT
Whilst talking to a medical friend, he has made a startling suggestion.... Would banning alcohol actually cut the cost of Accident and Emergency departments in half?... Depends on how many people get shot in the process of bootlegging the stuff.  |
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Post by silverdragon on Oct 6, 2014 7:42:29 GMT
Serve, and Purchase are two different things,
Its illegal for minors to be in the bar area, or even to sit at the bar.
But if bought by the parents, they can be given alcohol products, light beer (Shandy) perry or cider.
Where Given is the meaning of served I was meaning.
The law has changed, yes, but that was because many licensee's refused anyone under 16 getting alcohol on their premises.
You may find that most landlords still refuse under 18's even with a meal, and again, their house rules then become law.
As I say, its a bloody minefield.
A Major part of the licence test is understanding that part of the law.
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Post by Lex Of Sydney Australia on Oct 22, 2014 15:10:02 GMT
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the US ban booze at one point only to repeal the ban because of the soring crime rate that came with it? If you know it failed so spectacularly the first time then WHY the Hades would you try it again expecting different results?
& before anyone asks Yes I did read the whole of this debate before posting this. I'm just asking WHY here.
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Post by the light works on Oct 22, 2014 19:04:41 GMT
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the US ban booze at one point only to repeal the ban because of the soring crime rate that came with it? If you know it failed so spectacularly the first time then WHY the Hades would you try it again expecting different results? & before anyone asks Yes I did read the whole of this debate before posting this. I'm just asking WHY here. has anyone explained to you the difference between optimism and insanity? |
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Post by Antigone68104 on Oct 23, 2014 14:28:47 GMT
It wasn't just the crime rate, Lex -- the stock market crash and Great Depression had a lot of people looking for something that would provide jobs, and pre-Prohibition the beer/liquor industry provided a lot of jobs (and a lot of tax revenue).
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Post by silverdragon on Oct 24, 2014 9:12:34 GMT
I have had an idea thrown at me that I perhaps need to voice....
If you create the perfect solution, Nature will create a better idiot.
If Booze gets banned, what will they turn to next?.
All banning booze will do is shift the problem to an unknown area.
Therefore, banning booze is just sticking your head in the sand..... "It can be booze's fault we banned it"
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Post by the light works on Oct 24, 2014 12:20:28 GMT
I have had an idea thrown at me that I perhaps need to voice.... If you create the perfect solution, Nature will create a better idiot. If Booze gets banned, what will they turn to next?. All banning booze will do is shift the problem to an unknown area. Therefore, banning booze is just sticking your head in the sand..... "It can be booze's fault we banned it" I've been saying for years, "you can try to make it idiot proof, but they will just build a better idiot." but yes, you cannot effectively end the (I'm not gonna say human because it is not universal to humans) drive to render yourself oblivious to the consequences of your actions and then participate in actions with bad consequences. therefore, the general consensus, as I understand it, is to leave something legal that requires large doses and isn't all that easy to hide. |
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Post by wvengineer on Oct 24, 2014 15:13:00 GMT
It wasn't just the crime rate, Lex -- the stock market crash and Great Depression had a lot of people looking for something that would provide jobs, and pre-Prohibition the beer/liquor industry provided a lot of jobs (and a lot of tax revenue). Not quite. Prohibition (18th amendment) was passed in 1919 and went into affect on Jan. 16, 1920, long before the stock market crash. Prohibition is part of what made the "Roaring 20's." Illicit alcohol was part of the boom of the 20's. You can find plenty of info on it's impact on the decade. The stock market crash wasn't until 1929. By that time, momentum was well on it's way to repeal the 18th amendment. It was officially repealed by the passage of the 21'st amendment on December of 1933. |
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Post by Antigone68104 on Oct 24, 2014 17:03:54 GMT
Repeal is what I was talking about.
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Post by silverdragon on Oct 26, 2014 7:56:14 GMT
On the discussion of A&E.
On television the other night, they just had to do it, they had the debate.
Should people who smoke and or drink pay MORE for the NHS.......
Totally ignoring the elephant sat in the room making loud complaints whilst the Mammoth stomped around looking for sticky nuns, they whipped up the audience by asking shouldnt people who damage their heath on purpose pay more for medical treatment.....
Finally the allowed the sensible part of the audience to argue back that the tax system that makes a £1.00 pack of Cigarettes cost nearly £6.00 is in fact making the smokers pay more, and that the cost of a £5.00 drink is about 80% tax as well, .....
Unfortunately they got shouted down by those who want their hip replacement to be paid by those who enjoy a glass of wine with their evening meal.
So should Fat people be made to pay more for NHS?... well?... why not?....
They argued this, but "Found" that people with genetic conditions should not be penalised.
Well, Sod you then, because I dont see why I should pay more for the NHS just because I take the occasional glass of wine.
And in saying that, may I offer up that my weekly alcohol intake is lower than the recommended maximum by the medical council... by a hell of a lot....
But even so, I object to paying £5.00 for a £1.00 drink, which is Tax, which goes to who knows what instead of the NHS, because we have to support building schools to educate those who want to learn how to build bombs on the internet.
Or stump up an extra two BILLION in tax money to pay the europen union just because our economy is getting better...
Two billion by a week next tuesday?... yeah, sure, we have that in small change, of course.....
I will tell you why we in England do not have a Space program...
Because the barstewards in europe keep taking every penny we have and then coming back for more...
What used to be a trade agreement between certain countries has escalated to being the worst pit of despair where those that can afford it are fleeced of everything they won to pay for those who should not have it in the first place...
Meanwhile, every year, a "New" third world country is signed up as a money pit to sink or tax into.
And then invited into out country to make fast and free with our free healthcare...
No wonder all these countries want part of europe, thy will get free healthcare and free benefits from this country.. paid for by UK tax payers... who have no say in it.
I want to alter this thread to ask the question will banning freeloaders from other countries cut the cost of A&E.
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Post by mrfatso on Oct 26, 2014 11:23:18 GMT
I guess you are little bit angry about the new demands from the European Commission for an extre 1.7 billion Pounds by 1st December, after reassessing our economy, including parts of the black economy illegal drugs, fraud etc.. Seems a bit rich when France and Germany are getting rebates.
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Post by the light works on Oct 26, 2014 13:56:55 GMT
On the discussion of A&E. On television the other night, they just had to do it, they had the debate. Should people who smoke and or drink pay MORE for the NHS....... Totally ignoring the elephant sat in the room making loud complaints whilst the Mammoth stomped around looking for sticky nuns, they whipped up the audience by asking shouldnt people who damage their heath on purpose pay more for medical treatment..... Finally the allowed the sensible part of the audience to argue back that the tax system that makes a £1.00 pack of Cigarettes cost nearly £6.00 is in fact making the smokers pay more, and that the cost of a £5.00 drink is about 80% tax as well, ..... Unfortunately they got shouted down by those who want their hip replacement to be paid by those who enjoy a glass of wine with their evening meal. So should Fat people be made to pay more for NHS?... well?... why not?.... They argued this, but "Found" that people with genetic conditions should not be penalised. Well, Sod you then, because I dont see why I should pay more for the NHS just because I take the occasional glass of wine. And in saying that, may I offer up that my weekly alcohol intake is lower than the recommended maximum by the medical council... by a hell of a lot.... But even so, I object to paying £5.00 for a £1.00 drink, which is Tax, which goes to who knows what instead of the NHS, because we have to support building schools to educate those who want to learn how to build bombs on the internet. Or stump up an extra two BILLION in tax money to pay the europen union just because our economy is getting better... Two billion by a week next tuesday?... yeah, sure, we have that in small change, of course..... I will tell you why we in England do not have a Space program... Because the barstewards in europe keep taking every penny we have and then coming back for more... What used to be a trade agreement between certain countries has escalated to being the worst pit of despair where those that can afford it are fleeced of everything they won to pay for those who should not have it in the first place... Meanwhile, every year, a "New" third world country is signed up as a money pit to sink or tax into. And then invited into out country to make fast and free with our free healthcare... No wonder all these countries want part of europe, thy will get free healthcare and free benefits from this country.. paid for by UK tax payers... who have no say in it. I want to alter this thread to ask the question will banning freeloaders from other countries cut the cost of A&E. one of Mrs TLW's concerns about the possibility of a trip to scotland was what would happen if she needed to visit a doctor - which is a valid concern for her. but while you are considering that your country provides every new third world country with healthcre, ours provides them with a military, free of charge, whether they want it or not. there are times when I think isolationism is a valid option - although that is also an extreme. perhaps just stopping meddling would be a good middle ground. |
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