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Post by silverdragon on Sept 16, 2013 6:55:42 GMT
Copy of post on Watercooler....
So Myth to be dealt with....
We all know that the myth that if you have an accident with a safety helmet, its a bloody good idea to replace the helmet, in case there is damage you cant see.
So, Steel Toecap boots...
Just how much welly can they take before they need replacement?....
....Where welly is hammer, use, miss-use, abuse etc and not just Wellington abbreviation....
For the record, I have "spare" steelies, if I am in any doubt after this about the safety of my boots, I will be replacing them.
I intend to fill a sock with plasticine, put it in the boot, and drive over the toe-cap... if I dont like what I see, the boots will get chucked....
I think I may use a 7.5 tonner for this test.
I will do both boots and compare?...
I know the should be perfectly fine for this test, as they are supposed to be rated at higher than 7,5ton crush over four wheels (Thats close to 2 ton a wheel....ish...)
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Post by the light works on Sept 16, 2013 13:41:30 GMT
Copy of post on Watercooler.... So Myth to be dealt with.... We all know that the myth that if you have an accident with a safety helmet, its a bloody good idea to replace the helmet, in case there is damage you cant see. So, Steel Toecap boots... Just how much welly can they take before they need replacement?.... ....Where welly is hammer, use, miss-use, abuse etc and not just Wellington abbreviation.... For the record, I have "spare" steelies, if I am in any doubt after this about the safety of my boots, I will be replacing them. I intend to fill a sock with plasticine, put it in the boot, and drive over the toe-cap... if I dont like what I see, the boots will get chucked.... I think I may use a 7.5 tonner for this test. I will do both boots and compare?... I know the should be perfectly fine for this test, as they are supposed to be rated at higher than 7,5ton crush over four wheels (Thats close to 2 ton a wheel....ish...) I'd be inclined to do it with your "retired" steelies, just in case you get matching failures. or the compromised one fails and the good one is compromised. |
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Post by silverdragon on Sept 17, 2013 7:36:02 GMT
I am going to do it with the possible damaged ones....
If it fails, I know.
Better do that under test tha with a toe actually in them?...
No I dint allow my toes to get run over on a regular basis, but then again, I dont drop a door on them every day do I?...
I have spare boots anyway, and I am getting a new pair off the agency, Insurance pay out, anyway, so its not as if the current slightly damaged ones are that important?....
But as a good general question...
Its not as if I keep ballistics gel as a stock item in my home...
Or foot analogues.
What WOULD be a "Try this at home" good replacement for a foot that I can use for this test...?...
any suggestions anyone?...
Edit, Additional, what is a good standard for a fail?...
As in, I have one damaged, one good boot, what should I expect the good one to fail at?.. as stated, between 1.5 and 2 ton dependant on the wagon will be used, should the good one survive that?... and this is a slow roll-over test, not a sudden impact.
Personally, I would expect a 7.5ton gross weight, that is max 7.5 ton loaded vehicle, to NOT create catastrophic failure if a wheel went over a steel toecap "safety" boot.... am I wrong in that?...
I actually just dont know...
and that is where science begins.
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Post by Cybermortis on Sept 17, 2013 12:55:12 GMT
Helmets are made from plastics (or similar) which can become damaged and cracked without it being visible to the naked eye. Plastics can also become brittle and degraded if exposed to UV light for any length of time, which isn't a problem with metal.
From what I can tell 'Steel' toe caps are not always made of steel these days. I'm guessing that the newer none-steel versions would have the same general rule as hats - if you take a significant blow/impact it is best to change the boots. Although the surface of the boot would probably cushion impacts from sharp points enough to prevent them from being cracked in the same way helmets would be. For steel I'd guess that any impact that dents the metal is enough to require them to be replaced.
The closest I can get to how long you should use steel capped boots was a recommendation to change your boots once a year - apparently some employers will pay for this.
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Post by the light works on Sept 17, 2013 13:22:35 GMT
I believe the toe caps are a combination of the strength of the material and the shape of the toe cap - so it is very possible a deformed toe cap has lost some of its structural integrity.
helmets are a bit of a different story, because the boots are engineered to bridge the impact directly to the surface under the boot, whereas the helmet does not expect your head to be sitting on a solid surface - so the helmet is designed to convert the kinetic energy of the impact without passing it all to your head and neck - thus requiring that it convert the energy to the destruction of the suspension system and/or shell.
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Post by silverdragon on Sept 18, 2013 6:47:11 GMT
"Clothing allowance", or uniform replacement...
You are entitled by law to be able to request new safety boots once a year, not all employers will offer that, many will wait until asked (If Ever) but I get new boots every April come hell or high water, which is why I have so many spares... April is the start of the tax year, new budget, employers have more money at that time, and are more willing to listen to such requests.
Because I only work part time, I get longer from one set of boots.
This is useful, 'cos a set that you take off and pour the water out after a rainstorm type day can take a couple of days to dry out properly?...
The similarity I am looking at between safety boots and helmet is the one-hit wonder thing... after a severe enough impact, the helmet should be replaced immediately.
Is it the same with boots or not?...
Obviously damaged boots are not safe... but by how much.
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Post by the light works on Sept 18, 2013 13:40:35 GMT
That's why in Oregon it is customary to wear your pants legs over the cuff of the boots instead of tucked inside. |
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Post by silverdragon on Sept 19, 2013 8:57:52 GMT
I had to think that through....
Here in UK, no one tucks the trousers in their boots unless they are riding a bike and dont want that chain-chewed look.
Unless you have that elasticated bottom to your trousers that is "fashion"...
Even so, with the best intention, rain here gets in/on/under/through the lace-holes/your boots leak... after a day jumping in and out of the cab onto rain soaked pavements yards roads and the rest, yer feet get wet eventually...
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Post by the light works on Sept 19, 2013 14:24:08 GMT
I had to think that through.... Here in UK, no one tucks the trousers in their boots unless they are riding a bike and dont want that chain-chewed look. Unless you have that elasticated bottom to your trousers that is "fashion"... Even so, with the best intention, rain here gets in/on/under/through the lace-holes/your boots leak... after a day jumping in and out of the cab onto rain soaked pavements yards roads and the rest, yer feet get wet eventually... barring deep puddles or worn out boots; the only way I would get rain into my boots would be if my pants got so saturated that water was running down my legs inside of them. the tongue of the boots is secured to the leather up to my ankle, so even water that gets past the laces still sheds outside. |
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Post by User Unavailable on Sept 19, 2013 15:36:23 GMT
I had to think that through.... Here in UK, no one tucks the trousers in their boots unless they are riding a bike and dont want that chain-chewed look. Unless you have that elasticated bottom to your trousers that is "fashion"... Even so, with the best intention, rain here gets in/on/under/through the lace-holes/your boots leak... after a day jumping in and out of the cab onto rain soaked pavements yards roads and the rest, yer feet get wet eventually... barring deep puddles or worn out boots; the only way I would get rain into my boots would be if my pants got so saturated that water was running down my legs inside of them. the tongue of the boots is secured to the leather up to my ankle, so even water that gets past the laces still sheds outside. US black leather combat boots, which I wore for many years of duty use and still wear for hunting, have full gusset tongues and will keep water out in puddles 8 inches deep. I won't buy a lace up boot, unless it has a full gusset tongue. A full gusset tongue also keeps out dust, dirt, sand and other debris. At my old job, when doing sanitation work, (tear down and cleaning of machinery), we were supposed to wear trousers legs out over the top of our steel toed, rubber wellington knee high boots, when dispensing chemicals, so that if any chemical hit your trouser leg, it run off outside your boot, instead of inside your boot and getting a possible chemical burn, not only on your leg, but on your foot as well. However, the uniform trousers, which we were required to wear and which were supplied by the company, were a "straight leg" cuff, instead of a "boot cut" cuff, so were nearly impossible to get over the tops of the rubber boots and often bent the top in such a way as to rub the leg raw. The company wouldn't change the trousers, but did finally supply chemical resistant rain pants/suspenders, which could be worn over the comfortably tucked in trousers legs/boots, thus hanging down outside the boot as required by company safety practices. Note: we had a dedicated sanitation crew that wore the above mentioned rubber boots all the time, though most of us didnt. I kept my rubber boots in my locker, until it was time for the wash out of my machine. On a daily basis, I wore regular steel toed boots or shoes, which the company would reimburse for, up to $85, once per year. |
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Post by the light works on Sept 19, 2013 15:40:22 GMT
barring deep puddles or worn out boots; the only way I would get rain into my boots would be if my pants got so saturated that water was running down my legs inside of them. the tongue of the boots is secured to the leather up to my ankle, so even water that gets past the laces still sheds outside. US black leather combat boots, which I wore for many years of duty use and still wear for hunting, have full gusset tongues and will keep water out in puddles 8 inches deep. I won't buy a lace up boot, unless it has a full gusset tongue. A full gusset tongue also keeps out dust, dirt, sand and other debris. At my old job, when doing sanitation work, (tear down and cleaning of machinery), we were supposed to wear trousers legs out over the top of our steel toed, rubber wellington boots, when dispensing chemicals, so that if any chemical hit your trouser leg, it run off outside your boot, instead of inside your boot and getting a possible chemical burn, not only on your leg, but on your foot as well. However, the uniform trousers, which we were required to wear and which were supplied by the company, were a "straight leg" cuff, instead of a "boot cut" cuff, so were nearly impossible to get over the tops of the rubber boots and often bent the top in such a way as to rub the leg raw. The company wouldn't change the trousers, but did finally supply chemical resistant rain pants/suspenders, which could be worn over the comfortably tucked in trousers legs/boots, thus hanging down outside the boot as required by company safety practices. sounds like typical company policy. and in this case, I think the result was probably better than the original idea |
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Post by User Unavailable on Sept 19, 2013 15:49:45 GMT
US black leather combat boots, which I wore for many years of duty use and still wear for hunting, have full gusset tongues and will keep water out in puddles 8 inches deep. I won't buy a lace up boot, unless it has a full gusset tongue. A full gusset tongue also keeps out dust, dirt, sand and other debris. At my old job, when doing sanitation work, (tear down and cleaning of machinery), we were supposed to wear trousers legs out over the top of our steel toed, rubber wellington boots, when dispensing chemicals, so that if any chemical hit your trouser leg, it run off outside your boot, instead of inside your boot and getting a possible chemical burn, not only on your leg, but on your foot as well. However, the uniform trousers, which we were required to wear and which were supplied by the company, were a "straight leg" cuff, instead of a "boot cut" cuff, so were nearly impossible to get over the tops of the rubber boots and often bent the top in such a way as to rub the leg raw. The company wouldn't change the trousers, but did finally supply chemical resistant rain pants/suspenders, which could be worn over the comfortably tucked in trousers legs/boots, thus hanging down outside the boot as required by company safety practices. sounds like typical company policy. and in this case, I think the result was probably better than the original idea Yep, it worked out pretty well with the rain pants. That actually was a suggestion of mine and 3 or 4 other employees, who had all worked together at a previous job, in a chicken processing plant, where daily wear of rubber knee high boots and rain pants were common among many employees. |
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Post by the light works on Sept 19, 2013 16:04:08 GMT
sounds like typical company policy. and in this case, I think the result was probably better than the original idea Yep, it worked out pretty well with the rain pants. That actually was a suggestion of mine and 3 or 4 other employees, who had all worked together at a previous job, in a chicken processing plant, where daily wear of rubber knee high boots and rain pants were common among many employees. our bunker gear does that. our pants tuck inside the boots and the bunker pants go over the boots. the jackets have a double cuff - one inside the glove and one outside. |
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Post by silverdragon on Sept 21, 2013 7:38:54 GMT
For how long?...
Even if I did a parade quality shoe-shine on the safety boots I get, the leather is still porous....
That and the truck environment, eventually you will get scuffs on the boots.
I cant wear synthetic boots, I get galloping athletes foot/stinkfoot/sweat rash even though I wash feet daily and use clean socks every day, so I have to have leather, and eventually prolonged rain will get into the leather.
After a week of rain every day, my boots will have soaked up enough water to almost double their weight....
So in that case, I have more than one pair, and let the wet ones dry out.
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Post by the light works on Sept 21, 2013 11:20:24 GMT
For how long?... Even if I did a parade quality shoe-shine on the safety boots I get, the leather is still porous.... That and the truck environment, eventually you will get scuffs on the boots. I cant wear synthetic boots, I get galloping athletes foot/stinkfoot/sweat rash even though I wash feet daily and use clean socks every day, so I have to have leather, and eventually prolonged rain will get into the leather. After a week of rain every day, my boots will have soaked up enough water to almost double their weight.... So in that case, I have more than one pair, and let the wet ones dry out. well, if they are submerged all day, they will eventually bleed through to my socks. mink oil is your friend. |
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Post by User Unavailable on Sept 21, 2013 16:36:21 GMT
For how long?... Even if I did a parade quality shoe-shine on the safety boots I get, the leather is still porous.... That and the truck environment, eventually you will get scuffs on the boots. I cant wear synthetic boots, I get galloping athletes foot/stinkfoot/sweat rash even though I wash feet daily and use clean socks every day, so I have to have leather, and eventually prolonged rain will get into the leather. After a week of rain every day, my boots will have soaked up enough water to almost double their weight.... So in that case, I have more than one pair, and let the wet ones dry out. well, if they are submerged all day, they will eventually bleed through to my socks. mink oil is your friend. Yep, I mink oil all my leather boots, at least once a year, as well as polish when needed. I use an old tooth brush to work the mink oil paste, into the welt and all the nooks and crannies to small for my finger and a cloth to get into. Gotta remove the laces and mink oil the tongue too. I also mink oil my leather jackets and I have a few pairs of leather, military field gloves that I mink oil, as I wear them hunting. |
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Post by the light works on Sept 21, 2013 21:17:15 GMT
well, if they are submerged all day, they will eventually bleed through to my socks. mink oil is your friend. Yep, I mink oil all my leather boots, at least once a year, as well as polish when needed. I use an old tooth brush to work the mink oil paste, into the welt and all the nooks and crannies to small for my finger and a cloth to get into. Gotta remove the laces and mink oil the tongue too. I also mink oil my leather jackets and I have a few pairs of leather, military field gloves that I mink oil, as I wear them hunting. I used oilskin wax to waterproof a Carhartt jacket once - easier said than done, and it looked terribly disreputable when I got done, but it actually DID have water fall back off of it after that. |
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Post by silverdragon on Sept 23, 2013 5:17:00 GMT
I use a good quaility Dubbin on my boots, and throw 'em in the heating cupboard...
Gets plenty warm there when the heating is running....
I had one pair soak up half a pound of the stuff after I spent nearly a whole day up to my ankles in mud on a building site, had to wash the boots off in a bucket, the mud was inside as well.
Took them a week to dry out....
I now have a set of "Rigger" boots, MUCH better for working in Mud.
BTW, thats Home working... Wagon work, if the mud sticks to the tread on the boots, I dont go there....
Seriously, we have to clean our own wagons, so we do NOT go on building sites or muddy fields... the other thing is of course, we dont get free recovery when the things bog down, so we dont want the wagon sinking.....
Chucking the things in a warm place?..I also use the same trick when re-coating jackets... get them nice and warm, the oils soak in really well.
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Post by User Unavailable on Sept 23, 2013 5:59:35 GMT
I use a good quaility Dubbin on my boots, and throw 'em in the heating cupboard... Gets plenty warm there when the heating is running.... I had one pair soak up half a pound of the stuff after I spent nearly a whole day up to my ankles in mud on a building site, had to wash the boots off in a bucket, the mud was inside as well. Took them a week to dry out.... I now have a set of "Rigger" boots, MUCH better for working in Mud. BTW, thats Home working... Wagon work, if the mud sticks to the tread on the boots, I dont go there.... Seriously, we have to clean our own wagons, so we do NOT go on building sites or muddy fields... the other thing is of course, we dont get free recovery when the things bog down, so we dont want the wagon sinking..... Chucking the things in a warm place?..I also use the same trick when re-coating jackets... get them nice and warm, the oils soak in really well. Ugh. Putting your boots in dark, warm place, is exactly why your boots always have athletes foot fungus in them. Store them in the open where they can air out and be in the light. That is precisely the reason the military had us line up our shoes under the edge of our bunks. Not just for inspection purposes, but so they air out and the maximum amount of fungus dies off and keeps our feet healthier. |
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Post by silverdragon on Sept 23, 2013 6:25:17 GMT
I treat my boots with anti-fungal before they gets dried out?....and after as well, and every time I wear them, and twice at weekends as well, 'cos thats when they get cleaned....
Seriously, I do take great care of my footwear, because I have the athletes foot....
Or rather, I DONT have athletes foot because I take care of my footwear.....
Its "Under control", as in, you wouldnt know unless I said something.
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