|
|
Post by Cybermortis on May 20, 2014 14:34:24 GMT
May I enter an old joke... definition of Shin. A Device for finding furniture in the dark. How many of us can walk around the house late at night with no lights............. I know one person who cant, a good friend, his Missus has a habit of re-arranging furniture. On her own. At Night. We dont know why...... passive aggressive? Life insurance.... |
|
|
|
Post by the light works on May 20, 2014 14:38:54 GMT
ah yes - allowing your life insurance benefit to exceed your replacement cost. |
|
|
|
Post by paulsee on May 22, 2014 12:19:08 GMT
This is very interesting. Some things I am thinking of are things that you do while you are still groggy in the morning and are not fully awake. You repeat it so many times, you seem to do it with your eyes closed. Some of suggestions are :
1. Brush you teeth
2. Shave
3. Make Coffee
4. Make cereal breakfast
5. Turn on your mobile phone.
6. Start up sequence of car
7. Operating remote of TV
On the non-groggy side, I can think of some thing repetitively done on a daily basis that it becomes automatic.
1. Professional golfers hitting golf balls while blindfolded.
2. Logging in to the computer or filling up computer data by persons doing the same thing repetitively for a long time.
3. Playing a musical instrument that is very familiar.
5. Dancing a dance routine in the dark by a professional dancer
6. Rowing a boat in sync with others by a rowing team.
7. Doing a sword routine by a professional swordsman.
8. Operate a radio station booth by an experienced Radio personality.
Hope this helps
|
|
|
|
Post by the light works on May 22, 2014 16:30:13 GMT
I do not typically use the mirror to bruh my teeth
I have seen people shave without a mirror.
|
|
|
|
Post by Lex Of Sydney Australia on May 23, 2014 7:14:11 GMT
May I enter an old joke... definition of Shin. A Device for finding furniture in the dark. How many of us can walk around the house late at night with no lights............. I know one person who cant, a good friend, his Missus has a habit of re-arranging furniture. On her own. At Night. We dont know why...... passive aggressive? Or it could be a rare form of active sleep walking. I have a friend who suffers from this & he cleans his house in his sleep. |
|
|
|
Post by Lex Of Sydney Australia on May 23, 2014 7:34:00 GMT
This is very interesting. Some things I am thinking of are things that you do while you are still groggy in the morning and are not fully awake. You repeat it so many times, you seem to do it with your eyes closed. Some of suggestions are : 1. Brush you teeth 2. Shave 3. Make Coffee 4. Make cereal breakfast 5. Turn on your mobile phone. 6. Start up sequence of car 7. Operating remote of TV On the non-groggy side, I can think of some thing repetitively done on a daily basis that it becomes automatic. 1. Professional golfers hitting golf balls while blindfolded. 2. Logging in to the computer or filling up computer data by persons doing the same thing repetitively for a long time. 3. Playing a musical instrument that is very familiar. 5. Dancing a dance routine in the dark by a professional dancer 6. Rowing a boat in sync with others by a rowing team. 7. Doing a sword routine by a professional swordsman. 8. Operate a radio station booth by an experienced Radio personality. Hope this helps Ok first of I have to say REALY GOOD contribution to the discussion Paulsee seriously impressed.  Ok that said I think the entire 'groggy in the morning' routine is completely do-able. But I would still include the addition of getting dressed & making the bed. Now they could get around the NFT (Not For TV) bits by instead of having them wear underwear they can be wearing swim wear, & have them put their clothes on over their swimming costumes. (Karri's been in bikini's before for the show & Tory & Grant have both been on the show several times in swimming trunks & all that was fine with the censors.) As for the non-groggy side their were only two things on your list that the Mythbusters themselves could do without having to calling professionals (& therefore possibly having to pay for them). 1. Hitting golf balls while blindfolded -But lets face it only Tory is REALY any good at doing this. & 2. Logging in to the computer & data entry - This is something they ALL would (hopefully) be able to do. Given this I think we should just stick with the stuff for the morning routine/groggy side for this one. |
|
|
|
Post by OziRiS on May 23, 2014 9:57:13 GMT
Now they could get around the NFT (Not For TV) bits by instead of having them wear underwear they can be wearing swim wear, & have them put their clothes on over their swimming costumes. (Karri's been in bikini's before for the show & Tory & Grant have both been on the show several times in swimming trunks & all that was fine with the censors.) Does it really make a difference to the censors whether it's a pair of boxers/swimming trunks or a bikini/bra and panties? Except for the fabric used to make the clothing items and the purpose of them, I can't really see the big difference. Pretty much the same design (assuming none of the boys go commando on a daily basis and Kari isn't hiding something that would be considered 'naughty' under her clothes  ). Besides, Adam's been on screen in his boxers on more than one occasion and if Tori in a bra isn't disturbing enough to trigger censorship, I don't think Kari in a bra will be. If anything, it's actually a lot LESS disturbing! |
|
|
|
Post by Cybermortis on May 23, 2014 12:21:03 GMT
Keep in mind that the major issue with the cast appearing in underwear or swim suits is not the censors, but the cast themselves - ESPECIALLY Kari who would get comments on her appearance if she spent an entire episode dressed in full plate armour and had the visor down.
The groggy in the morning has the problem of giving them a very specific window in which to film things, and chances are that by the time they get the cameras rolling the cast would have woken up. The only way around this would be to film in their homes, which as I said is not something they are going to agree to allow for a number of reasons. Putting them in a more controlled environment wouldn't work because they wouldn't know the layout when they woke up. (Besides, for all we know Kari is liable to eat anyone who crosses her before her second cup of morning coffee).
I do like some of the 'blindfolded' ideas Lex posted, others are not things that the cast could do themselves which would mean turning the episode over to someone else - which is not how they do or want to do things. Working a radio station is something I doubt any of the cast could do with their eyes open, and even if they had experience the layout of the consoles would be very different to what they were used to. Heck, even the smallest change can throw you off - BBC Radio moved into a new building a few months back, and while the system used and the basic layout was identical to the old building almost all of DJ's ended up with long gaps between tracks while they were trying to work out where everything was. Certainly more than a few of them ended up playing the wrong track, and even after a few months they still end up hitting play for the wrong track - in a few cases they nearly ended up playing the same track three times in a row.
|
|
|
|
Post by Lex Of Sydney Australia on May 23, 2014 13:17:23 GMT
So basically what we need to do then by that line of logic Cyber is, find a series of safe tasks that the team does everyday that can be used to test the 'soul' of this myth/saying. Is the expression I can do it with my eyes closed still a valid saying? I know you suggested that we discard them getting dressed. But what if they were to wear a tank top/singlet & we had them put on & button up a shirt blindfolded? Do you think they'd be more amenable to doing that?  Apart from typing, & tying/doing up/putting on your shoes & socks, the only other thing I can think of is writing. Ok, ok so I know that it won't be neat or in a straight line, but what if we made readability the key criteria for this task? Can you write your name or something like the quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. With your eyes closed & would it be legible enough to read? |
|
|
|
Post by Cybermortis on May 23, 2014 13:56:59 GMT
Yes, the tasks need to be things that can be done safely - so walking around the shop is fine since someone could be there to tell them to stop before they walk into something or be ready to grab them if they were about to fall down the stairs. Using cutting equipment would not be OK, or sword fighting.
It doesn't have to be something they do everyday, but certainly things that they are familiar with and could do sighted without problems. So the list would be specific for each cast member - might be interesting to see if Kari could sculpt blindfolded for example.
I do kind of like the idea of the cast being able to decide exactly what should be tested, based in their own skills, on an individual basis. And unlike other myths that are tailored for individual cast members they would be making such decisions about themselves rather than getting others to do it.
|
|
|
|
Post by the light works on May 23, 2014 14:00:24 GMT
So basically what we need to do then by that line of logic Cyber is, find a series of safe tasks that the team does everyday that can be used to test the 'soul' of this myth/saying. Is the expression I can do it with my eyes closed still a valid saying? I know you suggested that we discard them getting dressed. But what if they were to wear a tank top/singlet & we had them put on & button up a shirt blindfolded? Do you think they'd be more amenable to doing that? Apart from typing, & tying/doing up/putting on your shoes & socks, the only other thing I can think of is writing. Ok, ok so I know that it won't be neat or in a straight line, but what if we made readability the key criteria for this task? Can you write your name or something like the quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. With your eyes closed & would it be legible enough to read? buttoning a shirt might or might not be good TV. many people tend to do that by feel, anyway. tying a necktie would be the same story. (except many people don't tie a necktie regularly enough for it to count.) tying shoes and writing would be good small tests. I still think hair grooming would be great, just for the opportunity to see the after pictures. - and of course, Jamie coming out exactly the same because all he has to do is put on his hat. |
|
|
|
Post by paulsee on May 23, 2014 14:53:34 GMT
Good point about "groggy situation" Cyber, and building on suggestion of Lex for safe things to do, here are some additional suggestions
(The cast can practice for a while and afterwards do the test)
1. Combing your hair without a mirror and seeing if it is better.
2. Skipping rope with eyes closed
3. Recognizing a set of instrument readings even if it is blurred and stating status of machine or device. (Not Really sure about this if this qualifies)
4. Able to recognize items used everyday in the office with a blindfold.
5. Have a set of keys and open a door everyday using the set of keys, then during the test, open the door in the dark using the set of keys.
(The cast members can do this on a test door and test set of keys for a time and do the test after a month or so)
6. Press or turn a set of switches on a regular basis and then do it in the dark.
Sounds like this would be fun!
|
|
|
|
Post by OziRiS on May 24, 2014 0:27:41 GMT
I've been reading through this thread from start to finish again and I have to admit that I'm failing to see the myth here.
I do certain things with my eyes closed or in the dark all the time. From simple things like operating the remote for my TV without having to look which button I'm pushing, because I know from the feel of the remote where they are, to more advanced tasks such as taking apart and reassembling my M16 with a blindfold on. I can navigate around my house in the dark without hitting the furniture, lock or unlock my front door without having to use my eyes to find the right key in the bundle and when I'm on training exercises with the Home Guard, I can easily find anything I need in my backpack in the pitch dark, because I know where everything is and I've done it a hundred times. It's all a matter of routine.
I was in a hotel a couple weeks back and it took me all but two minutes to learn where the important buttons on the TV remote were, because I always watch TV at home to fall asleep and I know which buttons I'm gonna need in the dark (power button, volume up/down, channel up/down and where you have to go to set the sleep timer - menu or single button).
Heck, I've seen NFL wide receivers who could catch balls with their backs turned to the quarterback, just from the sound the ball made as it approached them. There was a video on YouTube a couple years back where Anquan Boldin, one of two top wide receivers from the Arizona Cardinals, stood with his back turned, caught one ball with his right hand, a second with his left and then turned just in time to catch a third one by clamping down on it with the balls he was already holding in each hand. Routine and training. Nothing more.
So the question really becomes (if there's actually anything to test here): When do people beyond the shadow of a doubt exaggerate when they use this term? Could you learn to drive down a familiar street with your eyes closed? Could you learn to consistently bowl strikes with a blindfold on? Things of that nature. Are there tasks for which you could never get so much routine that you could consistently do them without the power of sight?
And of course there are! For example, no matter how good a shot I am with my rifle, I could never pluck targets at 200 yards with my eyes closed through the entire process, because I'd have to at least acquire the target with my sights first, or I wouldn't stand a chance. Once I've acquired the target - assuming it remains stationary - I can take it down with my eyes closed, because that's something we train. But if it's a moving target? Forget it! How would I follow it?
So, what are we really going for here? What would it require to deem this "myth" (if there really is one) busted, plausible or confirmed?
|
|
|
|
Post by the light works on May 24, 2014 0:49:43 GMT
I've been reading through this thread from start to finish again and I have to admit that I'm failing to see the myth here. I do certain things with my eyes closed or in the dark all the time. From simple things like operating the remote for my TV without having to look which button I'm pushing, because I know from the feel of the remote where they are, to more advanced tasks such as taking apart and reassembling my M16 with a blindfold on. I can navigate around my house in the dark without hitting the furniture, lock or unlock my front door without having to use my eyes to find the right key in the bundle and when I'm on training exercises with the Home Guard, I can easily find anything I need in my backpack in the pitch dark, because I know where everything is and I've done it a hundred times. It's all a matter of routine. I was in a hotel a couple weeks back and it took me all but two minutes to learn where the important buttons on the TV remote were, because I always watch TV at home to fall asleep and I know which buttons I'm gonna need in the dark (power button, volume up/down, channel up/down and where you have to go to set the sleep timer - menu or single button). Heck, I've seen NFL wide receivers who could catch balls with their backs turned to the quarterback, just from the sound the ball made as it approached them. There was a video on YouTube a couple years back where Anquan Boldin, one of two top wide receivers from the Arizona Cardinals, stood with his back turned, caught one ball with his right hand, a second with his left and then turned just in time to catch a third one by clamping down on it with the balls he was already holding in each hand. Routine and training. Nothing more. So the question really becomes (if there's actually anything to test here): When do people beyond the shadow of a doubt exaggerate when they use this term? Could you learn to drive down a familiar street with your eyes closed? Could you learn to consistently bowl strikes with a blindfold on? Things of that nature. Are there tasks for which you could never get so much routine that you could consistently do them without the power of sight? And of course there are! For example, no matter how good a shot I am with my rifle, I could never pluck targets at 200 yards with my eyes closed through the entire process, because I'd have to at least acquire the target with my sights first, or I wouldn't stand a chance. Once I've acquired the target - assuming it remains stationary - I can take it down with my eyes closed, because that's something we train. But if it's a moving target? Forget it! How would I follow it? So, what are we really going for here? What would it require to deem this "myth" (if there really is one) busted, plausible or confirmed? I agree that the threshold of what is good to test is the biggest challenge. you want to have something that is not so brainless that you can't miss, but not so dangerous that you'll hurt the crew. I've seen someone shoot a crossbow with a human target, while blindfolded - but I strongly suspect there was a bit of trickery involved - the target could see and was speaking to provide direction. |
|
|
|
Post by OziRiS on May 24, 2014 1:33:09 GMT
I agree that the threshold of what is good to test is the biggest challenge. you want to have something that is not so brainless that you can't miss, but not so dangerous that you'll hurt the crew. I've seen someone shoot a crossbow with a human target, while blindfolded - but I strongly suspect there was a bit of trickery involved - the target could see and was speaking to provide direction. You're missing my point. What you're all doing right now is trying to find ways (testing methods) to answer a question. The question hasn't been defined yet. All we've got right now is whether the statement "I can do it with my eyes closed" is true or not. For some things, yes. For others, no. Question answered. We're not failing to come up with the right answer right now. We're failing to come up with the right question. |
|
|
|
Post by the light works on May 24, 2014 2:01:16 GMT
I agree that the threshold of what is good to test is the biggest challenge. you want to have something that is not so brainless that you can't miss, but not so dangerous that you'll hurt the crew. I've seen someone shoot a crossbow with a human target, while blindfolded - but I strongly suspect there was a bit of trickery involved - the target could see and was speaking to provide direction. You're missing my point. What you're all doing right now is trying to find ways (testing methods) to answer a question. The question hasn't been defined yet. All we've got right now is whether the statement "I can do it with my eyes closed" is true or not. For some things, yes. For others, no. Question answered. We're not failing to come up with the right answer right now. We're failing to come up with the right question. the question is "what things can a person really get to the point where they can do it with their eyes closed?" |
|
|
|
Post by Cybermortis on May 24, 2014 7:14:11 GMT
If you look at all the examples you gave you'll note that they involve training and/or practice. The question is if you could perform familiar tasks blindfold without such training or practice. For example people don't usually train themselves to play the guitar with their eyes closed, and while they might claim they don't look at the guitar when playing if you look closely at professional musicians they tend to glance at the instrument. In the case of things like touch typing you may not be conscious if it, but the keyboard does rest within your range of vision and it is possible that your subconscious is feeding those images into the brain to help keep track of where your fingers are.
Yes, there will be some tasks that you could do with your eyes closed because part of learning that skill involves not using eyesight.
|
|
|
|
Post by OziRiS on May 24, 2014 12:36:51 GMT
If you look at all the examples you gave you'll note that they involve training and/or practice. The question is if you could perform familiar tasks blindfold without such training or practice. For example people don't usually train themselves to play the guitar with their eyes closed, and while they might claim they don't look at the guitar when playing if you look closely at professional musicians they tend to glance at the instrument. In the case of things like touch typing you may not be conscious if it, but the keyboard does rest within your range of vision and it is possible that your subconscious is feeding those images into the brain to help keep track of where your fingers are. Yes, there will be some tasks that you could do with your eyes closed because part of learning that skill involves not using eyesight. So basically, what we're allowing the crew to do is point out things that they either expect other crew members to be able to do blindfolded/with their eyes closed or which that particular crew member has him-/herself said in the past that he or she would be able to do blindfolded/with their eyes closed? Let's say Kari has previously heard Adam boast that there's a specific task he can do with his eyes closed or that there's a task that Jamie thinks Grant has so much routine with that he could do it blindfolded. So... Can they? The question then really becomes: Does eyesight have a bigger impact on the succesful completion of seemingly routine tasks than we're actually aware of? |
|
|
|
Post by Cybermortis on May 24, 2014 12:49:59 GMT
Exactly, although individual cast members may feel that they could do things blindfolded and be willing to try.
Personally I think you might have the right idea in getting the cast to give each other tasks to try out, since this would prevent them from cheating and practising prior to filming as they wouldn't have any warning as to what they will be 'tested' on.
|
|
|
|
Post by OziRiS on May 24, 2014 14:19:13 GMT
Exactly, although individual cast members may feel that they could do things blindfolded and be willing to try. Personally I think you might have the right idea in getting the cast to give each other tasks to try out, since this would prevent them from cheating and practising prior to filming as they wouldn't have any warning as to what they will be 'tested' on. That and the fact that they get to more or less challenge each other, which I think would be fun for them. And as we've seen in the past, what's fun for the cast usually translates into fun for the viewers. |
|
Ok that said I think the entire 'groggy in the morning' routine is completely do-able. But I would still include the addition of getting dressed & making the bed. Now they could get around the NFT (Not For TV) bits by instead of having them wear underwear they can be wearing swim wear, & have them put their clothes on over their swimming costumes. (Karri's been in bikini's before for the show & Tory & Grant have both been on the show several times in swimming trunks & all that was fine with the censors.)
).
Apart from typing, & tying/doing up/putting on your shoes & socks, the only other thing I can think of is writing. Ok, ok so I know that it won't be neat or in a straight line, but what if we made readability the key criteria for this task? Can you write your name or something like the quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. With your eyes closed & would it be legible enough to read?