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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 5, 2019 15:45:20 GMT
Captain Marvel, the latest entry into the MCU and the newest character, is out this week worldwide and opens this Tuesday in France. The build up to the film has been ugly. From lackluster trailers to Brie Larson mouthing off at every opportunity about how Captain Marvel was basically the best hero the MCU would ever have. Marvel has been trying to run some form of damage control, the old tired and inaccurate line about 'sexist white men' has been uttered more than once. While they have been touting pre-orders as a sign of wonderful success; Which ignores that pre-orders have only been tracked recently, we don't have figures for Iron Man, Thor or Captain America to compare. As such we can't use pre-orders as a way of judging the performance of a film in advance one way or another. Regardless the bigger question is how good is the film itself? And if the French reviews, which are not part of the Hollywood system, are good. Errm, not exactly if the following is anything to go by. {Warning; Article contains spoilers. Also note that the article is in French}www.avoir-alire.com/captain-marvel-la-critique-du-filmThe basic synopsis is; The film is dull. It has a strong feminist agenda, which isn't done well. Parts feel like a sit-com. The CGI varies from superb (the anti-aging on Sam L Jackson) to the poor (the flight effects are said to be little better if not worse than those in Superman the Movie) Brie Larson brings no charm, charisma or warmth to the screen, unlike Gal Godot in Wonder Woman. The writing is poor. Some of the acting is abysmal. If this is typical of reactions by those Disney can't 'buy' or threaten Marvel has a SERIOUS problem on their hands. Captain Marvel has been touted as the successor to the current 'leaders' of the MCU; Iron Man, Thor and Captain America and has a major role to play in Endgame. Some rumors have her being the character who ends up defeating Thanos. However now they could end up stuck with a character few are actually interested in (The Captain Marvel comic has been relaunched something like 5 times in 7 years) and a leading lady who has a knack for alienating 60% of the (US) movie going audience. Worse is that if Captain Marvel actually does end up beating Thanos the outcry could result in the beginning of the end for the MCU. Rumor also has it that there are at least two different endings for Endgame. One where Captain Marvel wins the day and one where she does not. Given the time frame this probably means little, as they simply couldn't have filmed a new ending this quickly. More likely is that Marvel either hedged their bets so if Captain Marvel wasn't a success they were not stuck having her win the day. Or Marvel filmed multiple endings in advance as a way to prevent spoilers (which I suspect is actually the case). Some have claimed that Marvel is rushing to reedit Endgame to downplay the role of Captain Marvel. Although, again, I suspect that this might actually be a case of Marvel having filmed several endings but not adding the 'real' one until late on to prevent anyone being able to leak the ending or release a bootleg version in advance. We shall have to see. Note; My rough calculations are that Captain Marvel needs to clear $600 million world wide in order to break even. Update; It seems that even the Disney 'shill' media is having trouble finding much in the way of positive things to say about the film, with the first review on Rotten Tomatoes being rotten; |
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Post by the light works on Mar 5, 2019 16:22:30 GMT
Time will tell. I never read the captain marvel comic. I also tend to only care about whether a movie is entertaining, which makes me one of the less biased reviewers.
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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 5, 2019 16:47:30 GMT
Time will tell. I never read the captain marvel comic. I also tend to only care about whether a movie is entertaining, which makes me one of the less biased reviewers. Even the 'positive' reviews seem to be following the same basic story; Regardless of if you support the politics being shouted about the film itself is just dull with a Mary-Sue character Grace Randall called 'Captain Feminist'. At best this seems to be mediocre in every respect, and doesn't tie into Endgame in any shape or form. Meaning that there is no need to actually see this before Endgame and no other reason to be excited about it. |
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Post by the light works on Mar 5, 2019 17:25:56 GMT
Time will tell. I never read the captain marvel comic. I also tend to only care about whether a movie is entertaining, which makes me one of the less biased reviewers. Even the 'positive' reviews seem to be following the same basic story; Regardless of if you support the politics being shouted about the film itself is just dull with a Mary-Sue character Grace Randall called 'Captain Feminist'. At best this seems to be mediocre in every respect, and doesn't tie into Endgame in any shape or form. Meaning that there is no need to actually see this before Endgame and no other reason to be excited about it. I found the trailers interesting enough to merit putting the movie on my netflix queue. I'll comment when I see it. for comparison, consider my reviuew of the female ghostbusters movie could be, "it would be a cult classic if it had a cult following." |
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Post by ironhold on Mar 5, 2019 17:58:25 GMT
I have to see this movie for the paper, but given that Larsen has already made it clear what she thinks about "white male movie critics" like me...
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Post by the light works on Mar 5, 2019 18:07:33 GMT
I have to see this movie for the paper, but given that Larsen has already made it clear what she thinks about "white male movie critics" like me... ... you plan to come into it with the same level of prejudice other people had because Ender's Game was written by Orson Scott Card? |
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Post by ironhold on Mar 5, 2019 18:16:19 GMT
I have to see this movie for the paper, but given that Larsen has already made it clear what she thinks about "white male movie critics" like me... ... you plan to come into it with the same level of prejudice other people had because Ender's Game was written by Orson Scott Card? Basically, because I'm the "wrong" race and gender as far as Larsen is concerned, nothing I say will count to her if it's inconvenient. It doesn't matter that I have a history of being professionally neutral. I've sat through films featuring some of the worst people Hollywood has had, yet held my tongue and focused on the film itself. This includes three films so far starring a guy who vocally hates my religious belief system. As a person, I'm at "fury of a thousand suns" level right now when it comes to this nonsense. She's directly calling me out, whether she knows it or not. Considering all the mental and emotional energy it's going to take to sit through this one and remain fully, professionally neutral, my weekend's pretty well shot. |
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Post by the light works on Mar 5, 2019 18:35:22 GMT
... you plan to come into it with the same level of prejudice other people had because Ender's Game was written by Orson Scott Card? Basically, because I'm the "wrong" race and gender as far as Larsen is concerned, nothing I say will count to her if it's inconvenient. It doesn't matter that I have a history of being professionally neutral. I've sat through films featuring some of the worst people Hollywood has had, yet held my tongue and focused on the film itself. This includes three films so far starring a guy who vocally hates my religious belief system. As a person, I'm at "fury of a thousand suns" level right now when it comes to this nonsense. She's directly calling me out, whether she knows it or not. Considering all the mental and emotional energy it's going to take to sit through this one and remain fully, professionally neutral, my weekend's pretty well shot. we all have our prejudices, and the fact that you describe seeing the movie while remaining neutral is something that causes your weekend to be shot shows that yours are affecting your objectivity in this case. I expect that will cause you to take a more critical view of the movie than you would otherwise, which may put it in the self-fulfilling prophecy category on Larsen's part - but it still leaves you prejudiced, like the aforementioned prejudice against Card. |
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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 5, 2019 20:50:32 GMT
I have to see this movie for the paper, but given that Larsen has already made it clear what she thinks about "white male movie critics" like me... That is literally half of what she actually said; 'I'm not interested in what some 40 year old white man has to say about Wrinkle in Time, it wasn't made for him' Funny how that latter part wasn't being reported until people, such as myself, pointed it out and the actual clip of that speech ended up being linked to on YouTube. Not that Larson comes over well here, or well anywhere. She comes over as being self-important and unlikable. The continuing rumors have it that critics actually HATE the damn film, but are hedging their bets not because they are scared of Disney but just don't want to deal with the toxic 'SJW' crowd. Some have apparently stated (unofficially) that they won't be reviewing the film at all. Even the 'shills' are basically saying that Larson's performance in the film is just as wooden and dull as the trailers indicated. How much truth there is in this is at this point unknown. But Marvel/Disney could have a major problem on their hands here. Having managed to get stuck with a character no one really likes or is interested in and an actress who is great at making people want to go and see every film but the one she is in. |
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Post by the light works on Mar 5, 2019 20:58:16 GMT
I have to see this movie for the paper, but given that Larsen has already made it clear what she thinks about "white male movie critics" like me... That is literally half of what she actually said; 'I'm not interested in what some 40 year old white man has to say about Wrinkle in Time, it wasn't made for him' Funny how that latter part wasn't being reported until people, such as myself, pointed it out and the actual clip of that speech ended up being linked to on YouTube. Not that Larson comes over well here, or well anywhere. She comes over as being self-important and unlikable. The continuing rumors have it that critics actually HATE the damn film, but are hedging their bets not because they are scared of Disney but just don't want to deal with the toxic 'SJW' crowd. Some have apparently stated (unofficially) that they won't be reviewing the film at all. Even the 'shills' are basically saying that Larson's performance in the film is just as wooden and dull as the trailers indicated. How much truth there is in this is at this point unknown. But Marvel/Disney could have a major problem on their hands here. Having managed to get stuck with a character no one really likes or is interested in and an actress who is great at making people want to go and see every film but the one she is in. if the film is that bad, then the correct critical response is to compare it to green lantern. |
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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 8, 2019 1:35:26 GMT
A short synopsis of the ongoing review's and situation;
One of the top critics on Rotten Tomatoes has outright admitted that many reviewers have 'softballed' the film. That it is still one of the worst rated MCU films on RT (around 82% critics overall, and lower for top critics) says rather a lot about the film.
At least one critic compared Gal Godot to Brie Larson in less than flattering terms. Describing Larson as 'humorless and unlikable'.
The SJW crowd has been screaming blue murder claiming that all the negative reviews are from sexist men. Ignoring that about six of the first ten or so reviews that show up are, errm, from women and no more positive of the film than the guys.
Rumor has it that the Avengers cast are not happy with Larson being elevated into a 'lead' role and a contract for some 9 films. They don't think she was a good fit for the role let alone as the face of the MCU moving forward.
Bob Iger is unhappy with Marvel for casting Larson in the first place, as only Kevin Feige wanted her for the role. No one else seems to have thought she was a good choice and Captain Marvel's appearance in Endgame was mandated by Feige alone.
Rumor also has it that there are two cuts of Endgame. A version that heavily features CP and another that downplays her role significantly. Shooting these alternate cuts cost Disney a lot of money, not least because Larson allegedly caused enough fuss they had to shoot the scenes on different days. (Note; There are no claims that she was being rude or unpleasant to anyone. Rather didn't understand the need for the alternate cuts...although that does sound diva-ish to me).
There is talk of them either ditching Captain Marvel entirely or recasting sooner rather than later.
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Post by ironhold on Mar 8, 2019 5:13:48 GMT
A *lot* of people, myself included, were asking about the Monica Rambeau character, who *did* serve as Captain Marvel at one point before going her own way.
Basically, while Carol Danvers hasn't lately been able to make a book last more than two years, Monica Rambeau has remained a fan favorite character despite not having a lead role in well over a decade. Instead, the "Captain Marvel" movie has Rambeau as a child in order to focus on her mother, who in this universe was Danvers' wingman while they were in the Air Force.
Given the fact that even a number of Disney shills are having a hard time falling in line for this one, it's already leading some of us to question if Danvers is going to be forced aside for Rambeau at some point if Disney can't justify re-casting the role.
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Post by ironhold on Mar 9, 2019 0:22:41 GMT
I saw it today and...
Holy crud but the special effects work in this one was awful.
You could *tell* when the actors or models were in front of a blue screen, and the 3D only made that even *more* clear because of how the layering worked.
And the digital effects on Goose when the shuttle jet first took off? Either the person doing the modeling has never seen a cat in person or that was deliberately awkward as a means of showing Goose's true nature.
This alone is enough for me to give the film a failing grade (less than 7 / 10).
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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 9, 2019 4:40:30 GMT
More news;
Rotten Tomatoes caused more controversy for themselves first by eliminating the 'want to see' option and score from the site with no warning. More recently they removed some 50 THOUSAND one star reviews for Captain Marvel. While it is almost certainly true that a percentage of those would have been trolls trying to drive the score down. The same can be said for many of the five star reviews, which have not been removed.
As it stands the audience score stands at 49% and the critics score 79%.
This puts it below Iron Man 3 and Captain America; The First Avenger in terms of Critics.
In terms of audience, even with a cull in 1 star reviews, it is by FAR the worst received film by the audience; The lowest (for the films) prior to this was The Incredible Hulk at an audience score of 70%.
If this audience score translates into box office performance this could potentially mean that Captain Marvel is the first MCU film to have serious problems just making its money back.
Do expect Disney to run damage control, which it feels as if they are already starting to do, by touting the opening weekend box office and utterly ignoring every following week, the drop off figures for the second week and remaining quiet about how much it actually made. I'm even wondering if the reason its release date was moved back was in the hopes that by the time anyone would be able to see the bigger picture talk would be about Endgame.
Lets just hope that they really DON'T have an ending there where Captain Marvel wins the day. If they do that could well be the beginning of the end of the MCU.
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Post by ironhold on Mar 9, 2019 7:13:44 GMT
Apparently, today, the 8th, is International Womens' Day.
Thus, according to the PR I'm hearing, Disney chose to have the movie come out today since it's a female superhero and the promo has been 100% about her gender.
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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 12, 2019 21:09:47 GMT
The film opened with a $150 million weekend domestic box office and around twice that worldwide.
However some are starting to question this to a degree as;
The validity of the (US) Domestic box office figures are being questioned, some are claiming that Disney bought tickets (for 'giveaways', which are it turns out tax deductible) due to many people reporting that even small theaters were at best half filled when they saw the film. (Which could just be the time they were there or the location itself). One thing that has been noted is that there seems to have been more 3D and iMax screenings that is usual; and these tickets cost more so would push up the figures.
This could be subjective and a case of sour grapes, but this is a higher figure than anyone expected by quite some margin especially given the lukewarm reviews.
One area where there IS clearly some shenanigans going on is the overseas figures. It has been noted that major films usually open over some ten days worldwide. In the case of Captain Marvel the film was released practically everywhere over three days, which would mean that the overseas box office is basically the first two weeks of every other Marvel film combined.
What is going to matter is, as I said earlier, how big a drop we see after the first week. Lest we forget Solo's opening domestic box office was just over $100 million. But the takings dived 65% after that and the film ultimately bombed with a total box office of just under $400 million worldwide.
Note; A rough estimate is that Captain Marvel needs to bring in some $600 million worldwide to breakeven, assuming a 50/50 split between US and overseas markets. At the moment around 66% of the figures are from overseas, so while Marvel may be crowing about how successful the film is it has yet to cover its production costs.
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Post by mrfatso on Mar 17, 2019 8:09:08 GMT
We went to see it last night, it was a solid 3.5 star movie, not the greatest but not the worst.
But there is another factor in its box office takings, it's part of the MCU and some people are going to see it because they are invested in seeing the whole enterprise with Avengers Endgame coming out in a months time . I know some friends of mine did not see Black Panther and then felt slightly confused by the section in Infinity War set in Wakanda.
Had there been enough time for Captain Marvel to come out on BluRay before Endgame they would not have bothered to go see it in cinemas but feel that as there is not they want to see now so something similar did not happen to them again.
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Post by ironhold on Mar 17, 2019 15:31:19 GMT
I'm seeing different projections for the week - over - week drop for this one.
It's normal for a film's week - over - week totals to drop 50% - 60%. But if a film's drop is greater than that, it's an indicator of problems. "Solo", for example, dropped 65% between the first and second weeks.
Depending upon what set of numbers you're looking at, this is projecting for 55% - 69.1%, the latter being Box Office Mojo's projection for the Friday - to - Friday drop.
55% is well within the "normal" range, but 69% is pretty bad. The film will likely at least make its money back even if people go by $750 million as the needed break-even point, but a 69% hit could affect the film's ability to clear a billion.
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Post by ironhold on Mar 17, 2019 16:33:30 GMT
Someone pointed something out that I had almost forgotten.
Disney is trying to get the rights back to the X-Men film franchise.
In the original Marvel comic books, a 1981 story arc had the character Rogue absorb most of Carol Danvers' powers. This forced Danvers to take a new set of powers and the name "Binary". Her powers didn't come back until some time in the 1990s, and in fact the 1990s X-Men cartoon series specifically went with this in order to justify why Rogue could fly and had super strength in addition to her absorption powers (although in the cartoon, Danvers had been a "Jane Doe" in a coma since).
If Disney decides that they need to get rid of Larson, they've got a pre-existing out now. The MCU version of Rogue zaps Danvers' powers, meaning that even if Danvers is still awake she's back to just being a normal human. Cue Monica Rambeau stepping up to the plate since the ending of the film made that possible.
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Post by Cybermortis on Mar 17, 2019 17:05:02 GMT
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