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Post by mrfatso on Feb 4, 2013 16:34:51 GMT
{Moved to Historical Information as this is not a myth - CM}Today archaeologists from the University of Leicester claim to have identified remains recovered from a dig underneath a car park as those of Richard the Third killed at Bosworth field. news.uk.msn.com/richard-iii-found-in-photos-940125They have used Carbon 14 dating, stable isotope analysis, DNA matching to someone supposed to be a relative, looked at cntext and compared it to accounts from the time. Anyone else seen these reports?
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Post by the light works on Feb 4, 2013 19:40:09 GMT
It seems like an odd thing to bury your king under a car park... ;D
quite the excellent bit of detectivery.
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Post by rory on Feb 4, 2013 19:52:41 GMT
It used to be a church, he was the last English King to die in battle. They now believe he was killed by a Halberg strike to the back of the head near the spine. He looks like he was a tough man, he had a lot of scars on his skeleton.
I work for a company who could sort out his spine problem. May have been able to defeat Henry if he had our implants in him.
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Post by the light works on Feb 4, 2013 19:58:52 GMT
It used to be a church, he was the last English King to die in battle. They now believe he was killed by a Halberg strike to the back of the head near the spine. He looks like he was a tough man, he had a lot of scars on his skeleton. I work for a company who could sort out his spine problem. May have been able to defeat Henry if he had our implants in him. my understanding was that they thought some of the marks were made post-mortem. but you have to be pretty tough to survive a spinal deformity in that particular age.
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Post by craighudson on Feb 4, 2013 20:18:41 GMT
I thought his 'spine problems' were one of those myth-type things propagated by Shakespeare, amongst others.
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Post by rory on Feb 4, 2013 20:22:51 GMT
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Post by the light works on Feb 4, 2013 20:47:48 GMT
and the jury is still out on the princes - other accounts say Henry had them bumped off to consolidate his claim to the throne.
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Post by craighudson on Feb 4, 2013 23:19:54 GMT
Aargh! When Horrible Histories said the history books have been telling it wrong, I didn't know it applied recursively to HH.
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Post by mrfatso on Feb 5, 2013 15:50:02 GMT
There was an interesting program on UK TV, last night about the discovery of the remains, the hunt for which were promoted by fund raising by a "Richardian" society, they certainly believed the theory that the humped back was a piece of Tudor propaganda. The woman that had done the research that lead to the dig was on hand when the body was found, was what we call gobsmacked, when they found the body with a curved spine.
Her research as to location though was pretty dam good though, it was found in the first part of the first trench that the archaeologist put in, which is the proverbial needle in a haystack.
Richard did not however have a withered arm, as in the Play, they were both evenly matched if a little "effeminate" to quote the experts on the program, he may not have been a strong fighter. That doesn`t tell us though if he was a skilled fighter or if he had a degree of guile or tactical nouse to make him a good general.
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Post by the light works on Feb 5, 2013 16:04:50 GMT
well, considering he was in his 20s, one might expect him to be a bit less burly than some.
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Post by mrfatso on Feb 6, 2013 7:09:43 GMT
He would have been 32 when killed. and are plenty of professional athletes who are in the peak of their physical condition at that age. He was eating a high protein diet compared to most people the time in England, and would have time to practise his fighting skills. IIRC they gave evidence of first hand accounts that said contemporaries even made note of his slight arms, they stood out compared to other nobles at the time.
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Post by silverdragon on Feb 7, 2013 9:48:37 GMT
The Licence to Search was granted on the grounds that the remains, if found, should be interned in Leicester Cathedral.... quite right, as that is where his "Tomb" is...
However, York (the City) has now tried to lay claim to his remains?...
PATHETIC.
He was found in Leicester, he should STAY in Leicester......
Its all about the Money....
York only want the remains so they can create a Tourist attraction.
(Post altered to stare correct city....next time I allow Spellchecker to corect spelling, I had better check it gets the right city?....)
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Post by craighudson on Feb 7, 2013 10:26:57 GMT
But he didn't really have anything to do with York, other than being duke of it.
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Post by silverdragon on Feb 7, 2013 10:42:23 GMT
Craig,
Now is the winter of our discontent Made glorious summer by this son of York; And all the clouds that low'r'd upon our house In the deep bosom of the ocean buried.
Lines from Shakespeare, and of course, Richard the Third became "The Son of York", in England's history, as his HOUSE is York, and Shakespeare has created the legend... In that quote, his Brother is King, whilst Richard is happy at that time, eventually further in the play, disposing his brother makes HIM the head of the York Family/dynasty and therefore makes HIM king.....
Yes you are right. My Family name is the same as a small town somewhere in the south of England... I have NEVER had any kind of attachment to the place, other than visiting it or driving through it... so do they have any right to claim I should be buried there if I die?....
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Post by mrfatso on Feb 7, 2013 12:09:10 GMT
The Licence to Search was granted on the grounds that the remains, if found, should be interned in Lincoln Cathedral.... quite right, as that is where his "Tomb" is... However, York (the City) has now tried to lay claim to his remains?... PATHETIC. He was found in Lincoln, he should STAY in Lincoln...... Its all about the Money.... York only want the remains so they can create a Tourist attraction. That was Leicester not Lincoln Silverdragon, but having said that they want to bury him in York Minster, which already is a pretty large tourist attraction itself. It was also pointed out yesterday on BBC radio 4, Richard endowed the Minster with money for a chantry of 100 priests and chapels, more than any he gave to any other church in England. They are pretty sure his intention was to be buried there. He also grew up in Yorkshire and was, I forget the exact title was it Marshal of the North?, but basically in command of the northern forces based largely in York.
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Post by mrfatso on Feb 8, 2013 12:11:20 GMT
Though having said all that the Diocese in charge of York Minster themselves, have said that they would rather he was buried in Leicester Cathedral, as it is closest to where he was originally interred.
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Post by Cybermortis on Feb 8, 2013 23:23:25 GMT
But he didn't really have anything to do with York, other than being duke of it. That's better than Richard the Lion Heart (Richard the First), who in 42 years as King of England managed to spend something like 8 months in the country and ended up buried in France. At least the later Richard managed to be buried in the country he ruled.
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Post by silverdragon on Feb 9, 2013 8:06:38 GMT
Not forgetting this Richard the Third.... Well.... Its slang for sh-1-t.
For Good reason as well. Richard was recorded in history as rather an idiot?... he wasnt well liked at all, and he was buried almost where he fell.... Reason being, the battle he was in, was a "Fight to the death" with a relative of his who was supported by people who wanted to dispose him as a king, because his tenure as King was NOT a popular one..... nor was the method he became king in the first place..... he disposed of his brother, who was quite popular by the sound of it?...
Erm.... Ooops?.... yes, you are right... post altered to correct mistakes.
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Post by privatepaddy on Feb 10, 2013 14:01:08 GMT
What I am curious about is the re internment ceremony, presumably there will be one. Do they invent one? or is there one on the books? so to speak. Richard III was a Catholic, does this pose a problem? and will a member of the current Royal family attend?
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Post by craighudson on Feb 10, 2013 17:18:15 GMT
Richard III was a Catholic... What other choice was there back then?
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