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Post by User Unavailable on Aug 16, 2013 16:45:48 GMT
This episode of Baa Baa Black Sheep, is not the one I was thinking of, but does have 2 P-38s on the show. One comment made was the P-38 could carry 2 cases of scotch in her boom tail and later in the episode, the pilot opens a compartment on the tail boom to give a box of cigars to the head mechanic.
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Post by the light works on Aug 17, 2013 13:42:15 GMT
This episode of Baa Baa Black Sheep, is not the one I was thinking of, but does have 2 P-38s on the show. One comment made was the P-38 could carry 2 cases of scotch in her boom tail and later in the episode, the pilot opens a compartment on the tail boom to give a box of cigars to the head mechanic. The idea there would be no place a transferring pilot could put a change of clothes was not computing.
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Post by User Unavailable on Aug 19, 2013 15:49:56 GMT
This episode of Baa Baa Black Sheep, is not the one I was thinking of, but does have 2 P-38s on the show. One comment made was the P-38 could carry 2 cases of scotch in her boom tail and later in the episode, the pilot opens a compartment on the tail boom to give a box of cigars to the head mechanic. The idea there would be no place a transferring pilot could put a change of clothes was not computing. True. Often times, replacement pilots would also fly in with replacement aircraft, so would have to have at least part of their gear/clothing along, until the rest showed up by transport.
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Post by Antigone68104 on Aug 27, 2013 15:55:05 GMT
I think the ice cream might be a bit of a stretch - not because of the temperature, but because of the fact that it would have to be stirred to get the texture. Not necessarily -- as I mentioned in the original MBFC thread, I have two cookbooks of WWII recipes, and the ice cream recipes were just stuck in a freezer. I'll post the details when I get home.
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Post by the light works on Aug 27, 2013 16:08:07 GMT
I think the ice cream might be a bit of a stretch - not because of the temperature, but because of the fact that it would have to be stirred to get the texture. Not necessarily -- as I mentioned in the original MBFC thread, I have two cookbooks of WWII recipes, and the ice cream recipes were just stuck in a freezer. I'll post the details when I get home. ah, I missed that. I would be interested to see if there was a specific freezing time, or if you just stored it in the freezer until you were ready for it.
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Post by Antigone68104 on Aug 28, 2013 11:11:06 GMT
Both of these recipes from Grandma's Wartime Kitchen: World War II and the Way We Cooked, by Joanne Lamb Hayes. No challenge to copyright is intended, they are quoted under Fair Use.
Sugarless Fresh Berry Ice Cream
1 (14 ounce) can sweetened condensed milk 1/4 cup fresh lemon juice 1/8 teaspoon salt 1 1/2 cups fresh raspberries, sliced strawberries, blackberries, or blueberries 1 cup heavy cream
Combine sweetened condensed milk, lemon juice, and salt in a large bowl. Set aside 5 minutes to thicken.
Meanwhile, puree berries in a blender or a food processor with a chopping blade. Strain puree and discard seeds. Beat cream in a small bowl until stiff peaks form.
When milk mixture has thickened, fold in puree, and then the beaten cream, until uniformly combined.
Pack into a 1 1/2 quart freezer container and freeze at least 4 hours before serving.
Makes 6 servings.
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Graham Cracker Ice Cream
1 cup milk 1/4 cup honey 2 teaspoons vanilla extract 1 cup graham cracker crumbs 1 cup heavy cream, whipped
Combine milk, honey, and vanilla. Freeze in ice cube trays or a baking pan just until center starts to set.
Beat cubes of frozen milk mixture with electric mixer until fluffy. Fold in graham cracker crumbs, and then whipped cream. Pack into a freezer container, freeze solid before serving.
Makes 4 servings.
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Both of these are home-front recipes, hence why they're trying to work around sugar rationing. The berry ice cream is probably a better one to work off of for a test; I don't know if graham crackers were shipped off to the troops, and that one calls for two freezings (myth states only one). On the other hand, I'm certain a military cook could trade for fresh berries if they grew in the area.
I haven't tried either of these, my freezer has a few quirks, and one of them is freezing meat solid but letting ice cream get mushy.
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Post by Cybermortis on Aug 28, 2013 11:58:08 GMT
www.ww2incolor.com/forum/showthread.php/3551-US-Army-Rations-World-War-IIThis gives a fair idea of what was included in WW2 ration packs, at least for the US military. Other nations would have had similar packs, if they were not using rations brought in from the US. Since we are talking about aircrews we'd be talking about A and B rations. The B rations - meals intended for groups but which didn't use refrigeration or fresh food - included fruit, fruit juice, sugar, salt, evaporated milk and crackers. So they had everything they needed to make ice cream except a way to cool it. B-rations seem more likely to have been used, mainly because of the amount of ingredients that would have need needed to make enough for more than one or two people. It might also explain why we have such little information about the specifics from the time - clearly using B-rations on this scale would have required the complicity of a lot of people not to be noticed.
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Post by the light works on Aug 28, 2013 13:36:18 GMT
aha, so it is a frozen whipped cream technology. I see how that will work.
plus, we then get into the question of what our threshhold for "busted" is. does it then have to freeze completely, or is a there a degree of refrigeration that qualifies it as "field ice cream?"
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Post by OziRiS on Sept 2, 2013 11:31:55 GMT
Well, "busted" would be:
- Little to no change in temperature or higher temperature than when the "ice cream" left the ground - Little to no change in consistency or "ice cream" has become even more fluid than before it left the ground
I think "plausible" would be if it's cold and viscous enough that it at least feels like partially melted ice cream when it comes back and "confirmed" would (apart from obtaining solid evidence that it was actually done) require a temperature below freezing and a consistency that would allow for a regular metal spoon to stand on its own in the finished product.
I don't think taste should be a factor. This was improvised under difficult circumstances and as such, something that tasted the slightest like "home" would be better than nothing for these soldiers.
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Post by Cybermortis on Sept 2, 2013 12:27:01 GMT
Agreed - WW2 British issue cigarettes were described as being sawdust, straw, a pinch of tobacco and therefore hideous. But that didn't stop soldiers from smoking them* and getting some satisfaction from doing so.
(*Although British troops did their best to get their hands on American issue cigarettes, which were of much better quality - even if Lucky Strikes taste like stale bile to Brits.)
Btw, we are talking about airmen not soldiers. This isn't a matter of being pedantic, but important because it indicates what type of ration is the most likely to have been used. Aircrews would be much more likely to be on A or B type rations (as for that matter would sailors) as they were working from bases well behind the lines.
In this specific case we are most likely talking about B rations, as the bases in question seem to have been too far away to get fresh food, but clearly were not involved in heavy action - ie they were quiet enough to allow the personal to think about making ice cream and set things up. Which they clearly are not going to have time to do if they are on constant alert or having to repair aircraft on a daily basis. So while they were not getting the fresh food A rations contained, they were not forced to rely on field rations either - which simply would not have enough ingredients to make a significant amount of ice cream without using up a lot of them. That would not be something that would be tolerated even by the most laid back of base commanders, nor something that would be easy to hide from the higher ups.
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Post by the light works on Sept 2, 2013 13:32:51 GMT
I think taste is a factor only insamuch as it needs to be palatable. if it is something cold and "set" and tasted good, I would consider it plausible. I think confirmed would require a documentable report.
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Post by Antigone68104 on Sept 2, 2013 16:04:02 GMT
Agreed.
I would suggest making a double batch -- one batch frozen in a standard freezer, one frozen (or not ... ) in an airplane. Test the two batches against each other to determine if it's "set".
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Post by Cybermortis on Sept 2, 2013 16:23:09 GMT
Agreed. I would suggest making a double batch -- one batch frozen in a standard freezer, one frozen (or not ... ) in an airplane. Test the two batches against each other to determine if it's "set". Good idea, first it would allow them to make sure that the recipe is valid. Then they could do a blind taste-test between the 'plane' ice cream and the freezer made stuff to see if there is any real difference.
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Post by the light works on Sept 2, 2013 17:48:06 GMT
Agreed. I would suggest making a double batch -- one batch frozen in a standard freezer, one frozen (or not ... ) in an airplane. Test the two batches against each other to determine if it's "set". Good idea, first it would allow them to make sure that the recipe is valid. Then they could do a blind taste-test between the 'plane' ice cream and the freezer made stuff to see if there is any real difference. I'd suggest a third batch in a salted-ice bath. partly to see how the plane compared to the traditional method, and partly because, hey, more ice cream.
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Post by c64 on Sept 2, 2013 22:59:59 GMT
Originally, ice cream wasn't stirred at all. The creaminess comes from using fat. The more you stir, the less fat you need to have a creamy texture.
Low-fat ice cream is made by "lots of string" using sophisticated stirring machines. The latest invention is "fat free ice cream" which is made by using a liquid nitrogen powered spray gun. At well over 300 bar, water with flavour is atomized just like in a modern high pressure direct diesel injection system. The fine particles freeze from the cold of the nitrogen. Currently, it's way too expensive to be sold in super markets but they are working on optimizing the process to be able to compete with regular ice cream with fat.
So if you add lots of coconut butter and condensed milk, you don't need to stir at all to have real ice cream! It's a lot different to what we are used today, but was the standard back then when people simply couldn't afford to get fat and didn't care about low-fat food.
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Post by User Unavailable on Sept 3, 2013 2:54:22 GMT
Low-fat ice cream is made by "lots of string" using sophisticated stirring machines. The latest invention is "fat free ice cream" which is made by using a liquid nitrogen powered spray gun. At well over 300 bar, water with flavour is atomized just like in a modern high pressure direct diesel injection system. The fine particles freeze from the cold of the nitrogen. Currently, it's way too expensive to be sold in super markets but they are working on optimizing the process to be able to compete with regular ice cream with fat. That has been around over here for a couple decades. It's called Dipping Dots (brand name). It's headquarters are not far from where I live. More about Dippin DotsThen there is Dippin Dots main competitor, Mini Melts. Both Dippin Dots and Mini Melts have low fat and sugar free versions.
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Post by c64 on Sept 3, 2013 19:28:15 GMT
Low-fat ice cream is made by "lots of string" using sophisticated stirring machines. The latest invention is "fat free ice cream" which is made by using a liquid nitrogen powered spray gun. At well over 300 bar, water with flavour is atomized just like in a modern high pressure direct diesel injection system. The fine particles freeze from the cold of the nitrogen. Currently, it's way too expensive to be sold in super markets but they are working on optimizing the process to be able to compete with regular ice cream with fat. That has been around over here for a couple decades. It's called Dipping Dots (brand name). It's headquarters are not far from where I live. More about Dippin DotsThen there is Dippin Dots main competitor, Mini Melts. Both Dippin Dots and Mini Melts have low fat and sugar free versions. Those are frozen ice bits. I talk about ice cream like in a cone I've tried it using liquid CO₂. It kind of worked but it contains "sparkling, fizzy bits" made of dry ice as well as plain ice flakes. 70 bar seems to be too low (ice flakes) and CO₂ partially turns into dry ice. So it looks like you have to use the "super expensive" and tricky to handle liquid nitrogen.
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Post by Antigone68104 on Sept 6, 2013 12:16:14 GMT
A friend and I are going to do some experimenting with the berry ice cream recipe, I'll post the results here. It might be a week or two, depending on what the supervisors do to my work schedule.
I note that in the original post, it was chocolate ice cream made with cocoa powder. I'm not sure how well that would work; every recipe for chocolate ice cream I've found calls for either melted baking chocolate or chocolate syrup. OTOH, I know Grandma used to make chocolate topping for sundaes with cocoa powder and milk. If I can find something similar to her recipe, I'll see if that works for making ice cream.
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Post by Cybermortis on Sept 6, 2013 12:40:27 GMT
The coco powder was one of the items that was included in the ration packs, and I'd guess was intended to be used to make a hot drink with. The other item that was included was lemonade powder*, which according to the site I linked to above was found to be superb for scrubbing floors but too acidic for most people to consider eating/drinking.
As both were standard ingredients in B and C ration packs (and hot chocolate is probably not your beverage of choice in the tropics) it makes sense if these were used for flavouring - and the coco more than the lemonade.
I also noted that a chocolate biscuit was included in the rations, and that this wasn't exactly the most popular item in there - it was called 'Hitler's secret weapon'. I wonder if they might not have taken some of these biscuits, ground them up and added them to the mixture for flavour.
(*Being a history buff I have to draw comparisons to the British Royal Navy circa 1760(not sure of the exact date off the top of my head). They added sugar to sailors daily rations with the intention of having the sailors mix it with the lemon juice they were issued to create 'sherbet'. Sailors being sailors they tended to just dump both the sugar and the juice into their grog**)
(**I wonder if the usual recipe - assuming this was done - used the lemon powder rather than the coco? My thinking is that base commanders may have been willing to look the other way if the men were using up something from the ration pack that they would normally avoid eating, and which contained vitamin C that they may not have been getting in enough quantity from the other items in the packs. The airmen may have recalled the 'chocolate' ice cream simply because it was unusual for them to have it...)
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Post by c64 on Sept 6, 2013 16:42:52 GMT
I also noted that a chocolate biscuit was included in the rations, and that this wasn't exactly the most popular item in there - it was called 'Hitler's secret weapon'. I wonder if they might not have taken some of these biscuits, ground them up and added them to the mixture for flavour. What flavour? If they are anything like the biscuits used by the German military, there is no flavour or scent. Parrotsm put them into their nest, dogs ignore them and mice put into a container with nothing but those biscuits starve.
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