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Post by the light works on May 10, 2014 15:47:55 GMT
braces on the yardarms and clewlines on the sails. the higher the yardarm, the more lifting action you have at the end of the arc because the yardarms are narrower. whereas if the ships are essentially banging yardarms then your arc may be more level. of course to swing form the opposite gunwhale across the deck and onto the other ship, you either have your line on your side of the mast, or you go through the gunwhale on the other side.
which is what my snark about the specialist crew to rig swinging lines was all about. the geometry and the available lines just doesn't fit. (which is to say unless the sails are furled, ALL of the rigging is doing something fairly important.)
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Post by Cybermortis on May 10, 2014 16:02:58 GMT
True, plus of course the rigging on the other ship will tend to get in the way. I can sort of imagine the opposing Captain looking on in astonishment as his enemy come swinging over only to go 'thud' against the hull, bounce off the shrouds or make very brief squeaking noises when they land on the deck and suddenly realise they are outnumbered four to one and happen to have their only means of defence clutched between their teeth.
You also have the bulwarks at the bow and stern which were what, around four foot high? You could aim for the gangway, but if you overshoot you'll probably end up falling through the grating onto the gundeck (a height of something like five and a half feet plus whatever height you had when you let go of the rope). I would imagine than crashing down onto the gun deck would result in the same sort of reaction a cat could expect if it slunk into the middle of a dog kennel filled with hungry dogs. (A moment of '!?' followed by a lot of fur flying.)
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Post by the light works on May 10, 2014 16:37:43 GMT
True, plus of course the rigging on the other ship will tend to get in the way. I can sort of imagine the opposing Captain looking on in astonishment as his enemy come swinging over only to go 'thud' against the hull, bounce off the shrouds or make very brief squeaking noises when they land on the deck and suddenly realise they are outnumbered four to one and happen to have their only means of defence clutched between their teeth. You also have the bulwarks at the bow and stern which were what, around four foot high? You could aim for the gangway, but if you overshoot you'll probably end up falling through the grating onto the gundeck (a height of something like five and a half feet plus whatever height you had when you let go of the rope). I would imagine than crashing down onto the gun deck would result in the same sort of reaction a cat could expect if it slunk into the middle of a dog kennel filled with hungry dogs. (A moment of '!?' followed by a lot of fur flying.) all of which, of course, means if they can get the logistics right, it would be great to test.
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Post by Cybermortis on May 10, 2014 16:56:45 GMT
Agreed, the biggest problem I can see would be in recreating accurate rigging which is more about time needed for the build than anything else. And of course the rigging only needs to be in the right places, not holding anything up, and only has to include one side of a single ship.
They could probably do most of that using scaffolding.
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Post by the light works on May 10, 2014 17:12:08 GMT
Agreed, the biggest problem I can see would be in recreating accurate rigging which is more about time needed for the build than anything else. And of course the rigging only needs to be in the right places, not holding anything up, and only has to include one side of a single ship. They could probably do most of that using scaffolding. steel pipe and roto-lock clamps - the staple of the staging industry. but you need a second "ship" to land on - so technically one side of two ships. - or segments thereof.
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Post by Cybermortis on May 10, 2014 17:29:04 GMT
They could do the swinging from a platform, rather than from another 'ship'. If they wanted to see if you could swing from a ship then they could use the same rig, but go in the other direction. All they need for the swinging too part is something they can tie the rope too, and probably alter the height of (to simulate swinging from the main or top yard ect). For that they don't need rigging, just a long vertical pole with another pole higher up.
Come to think of it, it might be a good idea for them to build the platform first, as that will allow them to see how far out someone will swing. That in turn would allow them to build the ship-rig at a reasonable distance from it.
The only limits with scaffolding would be needing to make sure that no one is going to get hurt if they swing into it, and the amount of weight it would be able to take if they are hanging ropes (or swinging off ropes) that need to be tied to the end of a beam. Creating an A frame for strength might not be possible for some sections as it could get on the way of their rigging.
These of course are the sort of details that MB would have to work out for themselves in detail when designing the rig, which would in turn depend on what they have available or could get in time and on budget. They could, after all, actually make a full on square rig with totally accurate rigging. It just wouldn't be practical in terms of cost and construction time.
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Post by the light works on May 10, 2014 18:24:16 GMT
They could do the swinging from a platform, rather than from another 'ship'. If they wanted to see if you could swing from a ship then they could use the same rig, but go in the other direction. All they need for the swinging too part is something they can tie the rope too, and probably alter the height of (to simulate swinging from the main or top yard ect). For that they don't need rigging, just a long vertical pole with another pole higher up. Come to think of it, it might be a good idea for them to build the platform first, as that will allow them to see how far out someone will swing. That in turn would allow them to build the ship-rig at a reasonable distance from it. The only limits with scaffolding would be needing to make sure that no one is going to get hurt if they swing into it, and the amount of weight it would be able to take if they are hanging ropes (or swinging off ropes) that need to be tied to the end of a beam. Creating an A frame for strength might not be possible for some sections as it could get on the way of their rigging. These of course are the sort of details that MB would have to work out for themselves in detail when designing the rig, which would in turn depend on what they have available or could get in time and on budget. They could, after all, actually make a full on square rig with totally accurate rigging. It just wouldn't be practical in terms of cost and construction time. I was being pretty loose with the definition of "ship." an a-frame wouldn't work well, but in a warehouse, they could anchor the mast top and bottom, and be able to fairly easily experiment with yardarm lengths and heights using a rotalock system.
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Post by the light works on May 10, 2014 18:26:09 GMT
for that matter, they could build Hollywood and Vine in the same manner.
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Post by silverdragon on May 11, 2014 10:31:16 GMT
Just as a "is this right", I remember something back from 30 yrs ago about being told that a sailor up one mast would not dream off climbing all the way down to get to the top of the next mast, and the has some sort of rope short-cut available, they would swing from one to the other...
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Post by Cybermortis on May 11, 2014 13:07:52 GMT
Just as a "is this right", I remember something back from 30 yrs ago about being told that a sailor up one mast would not dream off climbing all the way down to get to the top of the next mast, and the has some sort of rope short-cut available, they would swing from one to the other... Sailors would use the stays and braces to move between masts, or to get back to the deck in a hurry. They didn't swing, apart from anything else the masts on a sailing ship would be moving rather a lot in several different directions when it was under sail. So while you might have been aiming directly at a mast when you started the movement of the ship would most likely result in you missing the mast entirely. Or worse, you'd realise at the last minute that the mast was now heading directly towards you. In fact 'Skylarking' originally meant the practice of the younger members* of a ships crew playing games up in the rigging, which usually involved running along the braces between masts after dinner. As they, like the rest of the crew, were entitled to an alarming amount of alcohol per day it did bring a whole new meaning to 'high spirits'. This did result in deaths from drunken kids falling from the rigging onto the deck**. (*Young in this case could mean any age from 6-16) (**The higher up the rigging the thinner the ropes. The kids often played in the rigging for the top and top-gallant masts, and probably the royals as well, because they were small and light enough to use the ropes there without problems. Of course this meant that if they fell they would be doing so from a height of at least 70 feet.)
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